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And I didn't look at the hand history (GamesGrid just implemented them - I haven't checked them out though), but I'll see if I can take a look tonight.
/d
Statistics: Posted by starstealer — Thu May 05, 2005 2:35 pm
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At some tables, I think an MP open-raise with KJs is a fine play. Toward the LAG end of the spectrum, I suppose, but not overly so. The problem here is that, as you said, the player on your left seems to be obsessed with 3-betting your raises. This means it's possible that he's even doing so with a worse hand than you, but in general he's probably got you beat, and he's got position. So an open-raise here seems to be asking for trouble. (Nevertheless, I'd still do it because, heck, I really like raising
)On the flop, I think there's absolutely no question you're taking it to the river...and, I think your draw is strong enough to be played aggressively; even if you miss your draw, you may get him to back down and fold some AK-AJ sorta hand.
Of course, there's plenty of ways to play aggressively. Personally, I think I would've check-raised the flop and leading out the turn. If he 3-bets my checkraise, I'm willing to believe he's got a big pair and just call down and hope to hit my flush/gutshot. I think the problem with your line (calling flop, leading out on a scare-card) is that it doesn't look too convincing. Any time someone pulls that move on me (i.e. cehck-call, and lead when the bottom card pairs), it makes me about 95% certain that whatever their hand might be, it's not what they're representing.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that even though you got a big draw, you'd much rather see him just lay down something like AK or AQ without having to hit any of your outs. Leading out on the turn after check-calling the flop is one of those confusing plays that often triggers your opponent's "calling reflex" (A Mike Caro term, by the way)...the bottom card pairs and you bet, but he knows you probably don't have trips with any hand you'd raise...so he'll think you're trying to bluff him off and call you down with his AK. I'm not saying that's what he had this hand, but I just think your fold equity is a lot higher if you throw out a check-raise on either the flop or turn, as opposed to the stop-n-go thingy.
Just my thoughts, anyhow.
-TW
Statistics: Posted by TightWad — Thu May 05, 2005 9:45 am
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This is a hand from a $3/$6 table on Games Grid. The table has been fairly aggressive (like most of Games Grid), so a preflop raise will usually either be reraised or folded around. I hadn't played a hand in a few rounds and my stack was right around $90.
In the past, if I came in for a raise, the player on my left has reraised 3 out of 4 times. He has proven to be quite aggressive, but not very solid.
I'm in MP and open raise with KJs. The player on my left reraises and it folds back to me.
Here, I think is a no-brain call. While I may be behind significantly to aces, kings, queens, jacks AK, AJ, KQ - I do have outs. For only one bet - just like Tightie says - it would be weak to fold here, getting 6.5:1 to call.
So I call and the flop is Ts9d2d (I have diamonds for a suit), so I have the 2nd nut flush draw and a gutshot. I don't expect him to have a ten in his hand, so I'd count the Td as an out here - but I'm really leary about hitting one of my overcards. In light of this, I'd treat my overcards (6 possible) as a single out, because I'd need to hit both in order to feel at all comfortable. Anyways, with 9 flush outs, 3 non-diamond queens and one more from my "overcard outs", I feel I'm in pretty good shape.
I know if I bet that he will raise, so I simply check to give him the control at the moment. I am planning at this point to bet out on any semi-scary turn, including the board pairing, a third straight card hitting or my flush hitting. He bets and I call.
The turn is a deuce to pair the board and I bet out, as planned. He thinks for a little bit and raises me. At this point, I'm very certain he has a pair already - and since tens are not likely (AT is the only one I could put him on other than the made set on the flop, though I suppose TT is a possibility as well), I feel I can hit my flush or straight and be good. I call.
The river is a beautiful 4d and I bet again. He simply calls and I take the pot.
At the time, I felt my play throughout the hand was pretty bad (hence the reason I ended my session with it). However, after the call preflop, I'm not sure that I think it is all that bad.
Worst case scenario is him with AA with the ace of diamonds. Here, on the flop, I'm still not too bad off (42:57) - and with only one bet to me, it would be a clear call.
On the turn, even if I was expecting to get raised on my bet 90% of the time and 10% of the time he would fold, I'm only behind to him 3:1. On that round I put in 2 bets into a pot that will be 6.75BB including his two bets. With a little bit of fold equity - I think the bet out is very reasonable.
So what does everyone think? Am I just trying to justify a bad call? Was my preflop raise so bad that I shouldn't even be talking?
/d
Statistics: Posted by starstealer — Thu May 05, 2005 9:30 am
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