I do this a lot and I'm pretty sure it's been fairly profitable for me so far. Actually when I say I do it a lot I probably mean a lot more than most people I play against and with different cards. I actually do it very rarely.

The opponent is playing a lot of hands and raising a lot pre-flop. I have been playing quite tight (much tighter than my posts to the forum might suggest).


PL $0.10/$0.20 Omaha - (Real Money)

Seat 4 is the button

Total number of active players : 6

Seat 1: UTG ( $20 )
Seat 2: UTG+1 ( $9.14 )
Seat 3: CO ( $2.58 )
Seat 4: Button ( $38.91 )
Seat 5: SB ( $9.80 )
Seat 6: Chips->Middle ( $35.56 )

SB posts small blind [$0.10]
Chips->Middle posts big blind [$0.20]

UTG posts big blind [$0.20]

** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Chips->Middle [ Ah, Js, Kc, Jh ]

UTG checks
UTG+1 calls [$0.20]
CO folds
Button raises to [$1.10]
SB folds
Chips->Middle raises to [$3.80]
UTG folds
UTG+1 folds
Button calls [$2.70]

** Dealing Flop ** [ 7d, 3s, 9d ]

Chips->Middle bets [$5.60]
Button calls [$5.60]

** Dealing Turn ** [ 2d ]

Chips->Middle bets [$8]
Button folds
Returning uncalled bet [$8] to Chips->Middle

** Hand Conclusion **
Chips->Middle wins $18.34 from main pot

While this kind of move has been successful for me so far and seems like a reasonable way to fight back against over aggressive opponents, I risk a whole chunk of chips here for a hand that nets $8.94.

I have no idea what he calls the flop with.

This is all about aggression and I think if I make this move pre flop, I am more or less committed to following through with at least one bet on the flop regardless of what comes.

Any thoughts?

i don't like it. you are risking too much oop here. as you said, you have no idea what calls the flop. then he folds the turn. i think you are spewing here and got lucky. you could think to do this in position because the postflop disadvantage is just gonna get you in trouble. with position on you, they will play you more effectively and usually only commit money with a hand that will beat you and fold when they miss.

This sucks beyond all reason. Please don't do this out of the big blind.

Thanks for the responses. They are much appreciated.

I have been thinking about this hand pretty much constantly now since I posted it and I must not be getting it. I'm hoping that with a little more discussion I might get the message because you guys are much more violently against this than I would be. I'll probably split this into 2 posts.

The turn:

I didn't like the turn decision here when I was playing it or when I was posting it. Not so much that I thought it was wrong but it was just a horrible spot. I certainly was not feeling good about making the move. My decision to bluff was fairly simple.

Does he have a flush? - Ermmmmmmm ?????? dunno but not convinced.
Will he fold if he doesn't have it? - Yep 100%
What happens if I check? - He bets and I fold or he checks and I lose anyway cause I've got squat (in fact I think there's a small chance JJ was ahead).

So I bet the least amount I thought would get the job done.

Usually in situations like this, where I have no clue what the opponent has and I choose to bluff the decision looks worse and worse the more I think about it. I do this a lot and in the end I conclude that I chose to bet based on wishful thinking. Basically, I bet cause I'm a bet monkey and that's what I do.

In this case I'm still not at all convinced by my choice but I actually feel better about it now than I did at the time. I three bet OOP pre flop, convincingly representing AAxx against a player who raises more hands than I play. One of the advantages of me 3 betting is that he really has to be thinking strongly about AA and combined with the fact that the pot is large and any move he makes will cost him. This tends to make players more predictable (in the games I play). They will generally fold if they can't beat AA and raise if they can. So they'll go to the mat on any 2 pair because they are sure they're catching me overplaying AA.

I can think of very few calling hands for him in this situation. The flush draw is one for sure but:

1. most people know that calling on 9 outs is wrong and the guys I play against are much more serious about this when the amount of $$$ is larger.

2. This guy is pretty aggressive and if he flops a flush draw here I think he jams the flop a lot of the time. His range includes quite a lot of junk and if he's hit a flush draw on the flop that's likely about as strong a flop as he can expect. Re-raising the flop to get me to lay down my aces seems fairly natural for him.

Basically the call is very strange. The only in character explanation I can come up with is he's calling because he knows my flop bet is BS. He has a little bit of the flop or none of it and figures to take the pot with a bet on the turn or the river when I slow down.

The other possibility is he has the flush draw on the flop but is too timid to raise and calls along preying to hit.

I have no idea where I would put the % here for what he has but I'm not sure that I even believe he's 50% - 50% to have the flush and I'm getting 2-1 on the $8 bet into an $19.40 pot. Now had I not re-raised pre-flop and an opponent had called my flop bet I would consider him very likely to be on the most obvious draw.

So. I'm not at all convinced that I made the right decision on the turn but I'm not at all as certain as you guys are that it's bad.

One thing I haven't considered here is that my opponent is ahead on the flop and the turn and knows it both times. And that he is good enough to be calling along knowing that I will hang myself. There aren't many hands that were confidently ahead on the flop and still figure to be ahead given the turn card and even if there were I don't think he's that kind of player. He can have a str8 and flush draw or a huge wrapy str8y draw and if so he's just hit pay dirt. I could be wrong but I don't think that's likely enough to stop me betting here. What's more, if he hasn't just made the flush it makes my bet all the more scary.

I hated the position that I was in on the turn and this problem is the natural result of me building a big pot pre-flop out of position. Which is obviously a large part of why you guys hate how I played the hand.