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Keep teaching Phil!

Postby Danhdan » Sun Dec 12, 2004 11:12 am

http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_magazin ... a_id=14405

This article is from the new Card player by Phil Hellmuth. It's about a friend of his named Greg. Hand #2 is of particular interest because it talks about how Greg checkraised all in on a draw against what I have to assume is an incredibly weak player who was pretty aggressive(guy raised preflop w/ A9). If Phil is going to teach people that going all in on draws in a cash game is a good idea, I think we can expect to playing more and more "talented" people in NL games.

Anyone have any thoughts on this article??
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Postby iceman5 » Sun Dec 12, 2004 11:57 am

Hand #2 is freaking horrible. Especially if hes been watching the other guy who is just as bad. You cant bluff a weak player like that with a draw. You have no folding equity.
Also, calling with nothing with the intention of taking the hand away later is a bad play in most cash games. It might work sometimes in the later stages of a tournament, but in a cash game the opponent will get pot committed alot of times and call...or.. he just wont lay down top pair.
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Postby excession » Sun Dec 12, 2004 12:50 pm

I had a couple of hands tonight that I couldn't help but shake my head and laugh out loud - both are about firing the second barrel with nothing..


Earning bonuses at paradise and UB at the mo':

I'm OTB with AKo.My stack is $46. Immediately to my left is a guy who is LAA - plays 50% and raises 20%. He's got a $20 stack.

2 limpers(both about $20 stacks) around to him. He ( bets $2.75 (it's a 25c/50c table)

Now I view AK as a drawing hand and always am happy to cold call a small raise with it esp if the raiser is a little loose...

The blinds fold and both limpers complete.

Pot $11.75
Flop rainbow K43

The limpers check and he bets $5 into the pot - OK not a bad play - unless I've an ace or a king I'm folding and the pot is probably his for very little risk (unless one of the limpers is looking to check raise but they ain't that sophisticated). Tha's the thing about flat calling with AK -0nice disguise when you hit and the 'leader' usually bets in.

No risk of a draw I can see so I just pause a moment and flat call.

I am a bit suprised when one of the limpers completes.


Turn is a rainbow ace. This leaves me looking good.

Limper just checks. And the LAP pushes all-in. I call. Limper folds . River is blank and my AKo takes down his 104o...


The lesson here is that if you are going to bluff with nothing based on position and a tighter player who has better position than you makes like a brick wall - don't keep firing at the pot -:) Apart from anything else you don't half look stupid at showdown :)


Other pot is one I lost on the same principal.

Paradise 25c/50c tables - play is noticeably worse than UB.

I'm in MP with QJs. Table is passive and short-handed (8 in). I have $30 . Guy to my right has $60 and is loose.

Folded to me - I make a $2 raise. He sees it. SB completes. Serves me right for trying to be a smartarse!

Flop rainbow 953 - junk.
Pot is $8. Checked to me. I bet $5

He smooth calls. Other guy folds.

Turn is rainbow K. I don't like that much.


I don't fire again. He checks.

River 8

I look to see if he could be on a draw that he has missed and so maybe a bet of 50% of the pot would take it down. iI can't see one though so figure I'll just chalk this one up to the fact that occasionally foks hit flops.

We check it down. He wins with A4s ! :)

Yes he did call that 3xBB raise with A4s and $5 flop bet down with ace awful kicker and an inside straight draw.

The lesson I learneed here is that at low levels folks will call with anything and very rarely is a turn check a set up for a re-raise on the river.

I'm still not so sure that I'd pull the trigger in the same situation again though - weak tight or just sensible?
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Postby Nortonesque » Sun Dec 12, 2004 1:09 pm

I saw a guy call down with 33 on a board of 448A7 last night, against a preflop raiser who bet every street and went all in on the river. The raiser had KQs, and was mighty pissed. Yeah, don't bluff those calling stations.

I find it somewhat amusing that Phil has been suckered into investing in a dotcom startup.
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Not to hijack my own thread...

Postby Danhdan » Sun Dec 12, 2004 5:02 pm

But I found that pumping a stock in a widely read article that has nothing to do with investing is ethicly unsound to say the least. I don't know for sure, but I think that there is a responsibility to his readers that he is ignoring.

Anyway, I guess Phil's been playing in too many tournaments to read his own columns.
"Million dollar play, ten cent finish."

"My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives."

"Laugh and the world stares at you; cry, and the world stares at you."
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