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Calling down with K-high and A-high on river... - Live Poker Forums

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Calling down with K-high and A-high on river...

Postby EscapePlan9 » Thu Aug 18, 2005 4:04 am

I admit it. I fold on the river more often than not with a-high and k-high. Even if the board is extremely raggedy, I'm so paranoid the player would be loose enough to call down with a pair of threes to the river.

I've been trying to figure out situations when it's likely they also were on a draw and missed. Like if the board reads 552 with two diamonds, in most cases I'd say my AK would still be ahead on the flop. The turn is an 8. The river a J (and neither are diamonds). There was a flush and straight possibility, so it's somewhat likely I'm being called down by a draw. I'd bet the flop and turn here and check-call the river. Sure he could have a jack, but the only reasonable way for him to stay with a jack would be if he held two diamonds.

Othertimes, the board is so raggedy, I'll just call down. Like here:

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (8 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with [Qs], [Kc].
2 folds, Hero raises, 4 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) [3h], [4c], [4d] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

Turn: (3.25 BB) [8c] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

River: (5.25 BB) [7s] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.25 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Qs Kc (one pair, fours).
BB has Td 5c (one pair, fours).
Outcome: Hero wins 7.25 BB.


The bet came out of nowhere. The only hand it might represent would be drawing with 56. Everything else doesn't make sense.

Another example... this time with A-high. This time I had a read on the player. I've seen this guy play enough to know he is VERY loose and aggressive. He will re-raise with weak draws, bottom pair, etc.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (8 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with [Tc], [As].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 3 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, MP1 calls.

Flop: (5 SB) [Kc], [5d], [3h] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP1 calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) [6c] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP1 raises, Hero calls.

River: (7.50 BB) [Qs] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 9.50 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Tc As (high card, ace).
MP1 has 7c 8h (high card, king).
Outcome: Hero wins 9.50 BB.


I didn't like seeing that Q on the river, but once again... he was very LAGgy.

I still need to work on calling down with A-high, K-high and middle-pair at the right times.
Last edited by EscapePlan9 on Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Thu Aug 18, 2005 2:26 pm

Hooray, I made another good call-down today! Villain here was semi-loose and somewhat aggressive.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with [Ah], [Qh].
Hero raises, 5 folds, SB calls, 1 fold.

Flop: (5 SB) [3s], [6d], [5s] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) [5h] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: (5.50 BB) [7h] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB

He also had A-high. But I had a better kicker. He bet instantly on the turn and river and I really didn't put him on a 5.

Funny part... after I called him down he said "fish".
Last edited by EscapePlan9 on Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:09 pm

This'll just be my sticky thread for times when I correctly called down with K-high or A-high.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (6 max, 9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with [Qh], [Kh].
Hero raises, 2 folds, MP2 calls, 5 folds.

Flop: (5.50 SB) [9c], [9d], [3d] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP2 calls.

Turn: (3.75 BB) [5s] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP2 calls.

River: (5.75 BB) [Ah] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.75 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Qh Kh (one pair, nines).
MP2 has Td Qd (one pair, nines).
Outcome: Hero wins 7.75 BB.


On the river I had to think for a while. I didn't think he had a 9 or 3 on the flop, so a flush draw was likely. He still didn't raise me on the turn, so I thought he either had a really weak hand or was still drawing. I just didn't see how an ace could fit into his holdings here unless he held AX with two diamonds. If he was unpaired, I knew I had the best hand. The flop was certainly raggedy enough minus the river, so I thought it was worth a call.

So far I've correctly called down with A-high and K-high more than 75% of the time and I only need to be correct 10-20% of the time (depends on pot size on river obviously).
Last edited by EscapePlan9 on Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby briachek » Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:28 pm

converter seems to be wrong on that last one, it said he had TdQd whcih would be a flush.
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Postby CFlannagan » Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:29 pm

EP -

In your last post, I think there's a typo cuz if those cards are correct, MP2 would have won with flush, not you (his Qd Td hand plus 9d, 3d on the flop and 5d on the turn for the flush).

edit: briachek caught it too while I was typing this :)
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:10 pm

I see... I don't remember what the suit was. I just changed it to a spade since he obviously didn't make the flush. Dunno what happened there...
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Sun Sep 11, 2005 2:16 am

I actually haven't had many calling down with a-high and k-high predicaments lately. There were times where I checked the river and said "if he bets, I'm still going to call", but then there was no bet. Ah well, can't argue with that. Makes my decision making easier!
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Postby Nortonesque » Sun Sep 11, 2005 11:59 am

This is definitely a skill you'll need when you move up. I didn't spend a lot of time thinking about it at $2/4 and below, because fewer pots are heads up and players are less likely to bluff the river, but at the $3/6 I think about it much more frequently.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Wed Sep 14, 2005 2:56 pm

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with [Kc], [Ad].
UTG calls, 5 folds, Button calls, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG calls, Button calls.

Flop: (8 SB) [2s], [7d], [Jd] (4 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG calls, Button folds.

Turn: (5 BB) [Jh] (2 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls.

River: (7 BB) [9c] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 9 BB

Results in white below:
UTG has Ks Qc (one pair, jacks).
Hero has Kc Ad (one pair, jacks).
Outcome: Hero wins 9 BB.


I hadn't played enough hands with UTG to have any good read on him. All I knew was he was loose and often didn't raise PF.

When he didn't pop me on the turn, I figured him for a draw or weak pair. I thought there was at least a 15% chance he was on a draw here and made the right call.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Sat Oct 01, 2005 2:34 am

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is CO with [Kh], [As].
UTG calls, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, 3 folds, UTG folds, MP caps, Hero calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) [Ts], [7d], [6c] (2 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (6.25 BB) [2h] (2 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

River: (8.25 BB) [9c] (2 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.25 BB

Villain was extremely laggy - something like 65/25. And the board wasn't too scary.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Tue Oct 11, 2005 12:51 pm

Villain wasn't anything out of line. Something like 26% VP$IP, 8% PFR, 32% WtSD.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 4 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with [Ac], [Qd].
1 fold, Button raises, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, Button calls.

Flop: (7 SB) [8c], [4d], [4s] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) [9s] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button calls.

River: (6.50 BB) [2d] (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

Results in white below:
Button has As 3s (one pair, fours).
Hero has Ac Qd (one pair, fours).
Outcome: Hero wins 8.50 BB.


I figured his most likely stealing hand was AX and I'm only behind to AK if he hasn't paired. The board pairing also helps out since there's less cards that could fit his AX holdings.
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Postby Ichoi » Tue Oct 11, 2005 8:56 pm

I no longer have the handhistory, but I almost never call with king high, here's the one hand (from memory, but it's right) where I correctly called with king high.



5/10 6 Max (Party)
Hero is button.

Dealt to Hero [Kh] [Qh]

3 Folds, Hero raises, SB folds, BB calls.

Flop: [Th] [9h] [6d]
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises, Hero reraises, bb calls.

Turn: [Th] [9h] [6d] [9s]
BB checks, Hero bets, bb calls.

River: [Th] [9h] [6d] [9s] [Td]
BB bets, hero calls.

And he shows 67s (don't remember suits, but they weren't both hearts) and I take it down with king high.
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Postby EscapePlan9 » Thu Oct 13, 2005 6:28 pm

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with [Kh], [Ac].
Hero raises, 4 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) [6s], [4c], [8h] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

Turn: (3.25 BB) [3s] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

River: (5.25 BB) [6d] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.25 BB

Villain was LAGgy, especially pre-flop. He's bluff-raised a flush possibility on the river before. I thought there was a good chance he just had random overcards (or random cards in general), and his lead bet on the scare card told me he probably doesn't have a six.

Results in white below:
BB has Th Ad (one pair, sixes).
Hero has Kh Ac (one pair, sixes).
Outcome: Hero wins 7.25 BB.
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Postby Ichoi » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:36 am

I had every intention of going to showdown with king high from the flop on. I just didn't buy it. I have played against this player before (probably 3000 hands against him) and this just didn't feel right to me. I can't quite explain why, but never have I felt so confident calling with king high on the river.

It was like a moment of poker clarity... I was just so sure he didn't have it. It was great.

10/20 4 Handed (Full Tilt)

Hero is BB with [Ks] [Tc]
2 Folds, SB calls, Hero raises, SB calls.

Flop: [7s] [2s] [5h]
SB bets, Hero calls.

Turn: [7s] [2s] [5h] [5d]
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: [7s] [2s] [5h] [5d] [7c]
SB bets, Hero calls.

SB Shows: [Td] [3d] (Two pair, sevens and fives with a ten kicker.)
Hero shows: [Ks] [Tc] (Two pair, sevens and fives with a king kicker.)

Hero wins $138
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Postby Tiburon » Sun Oct 16, 2005 9:34 am

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