Kuso, the title of my post was meant to point out the dissolution of the "Party Network." I, too, will attempt to take advantage of the looser tables, although I don't believe that it will last too long.

I was lamenting the loss of rakeback because that's exactly how I perceived the effect (on me) of Party's change. But, I'm not above an occasional bonus, so that probably lumps me into that group you don't mind seeing screwed. That's plenty ornery enough for me.

If you play as well as you suggest, you probably beat up the bonus whores already. So why would you want them to suffer? Or why would you want them to learn to play better poker? I'm glad you're glad.

I don't understand why people think they are being screwed over though. The poker is still there right? That is the main reason for the poker sites isn't it? Maybe some folks who only do it to break even and clear bonuses won't be able to clear it as lightning fast as they used to be able to do, but they aren't getting screwed over. Rakeback IS there if you really want it. My affilliate told me some folks may have to close their account at Party and resign up with a different email account, but it is available for the folks who really want it and are willing to jump through the required hoops to do so. And I know for a fact that you can do this because I've done it once already in the past, although I never bothered closing my old account. I just created an entirely new account with a different player name and email address.

Let me clear some things up...

1) I was a bit, um, "tipsy" when I wrote that post.

2) As such, QuickLearner, I made some mistakes. This message was NOT directed at you -- apologies if you feel that way. Furthermore, you are correct in that I am not actually referring to the Party "Network", but actually "Party". Sorry for being confusing. The logic when I wrote the post was that I am _glad_ that the Party Network is seperated from the mothership now (reasons below). Drunk logic is never any good.

3) Seb... my "screw" comment was merely an exclamation -- "SCREW THE BONUS WHORES!" The reason I dislike them so much is that for every skins reload bonus, these wankers invade my tables and turn them into rock gardens (40-50% vpip before bonus, 25-30% after). in plo8, it is really difficult to make good money in a rock garden, as you rarely get paid off when you have a hand. Even hands that I thought were relatively well disguised got folded to when I even made a smallish bet. The tables got so tight during bonuses that I wouldn't play at Party for the first few days. Furthermore, the Multi Reload Madness bonuses added a rock or two to each of my tables throughout the entire month. There could be a donator in that seat.

I realize that the tables will still be tight when the Party bonus comes out, but now I don't have to worry about the Empire and Multi reloads. That's at least 6 more days of quality play for me, and I think the tables will improve overall throughout the month. The PTO stats I am looking at now are nothing short of the juiciest I've seen since July (pre-Multi Reload Madness).

4) The whores get screwed by not being able to whore all month by nut-peddling. They will get one smallish Party bonus that they clear quickly, and that's it. As for PLO8, there are a small fraction of plo8 tables at the skins as compared to party. I'm guessing almost all of the skins players were whores at the lower limits (rakeback at the higher limits). The whores at BW are REALLY b!tching about the lack of O8 tables, so I know that this split hurt them. Many of them are abandoning the Multi bonuses. FWIW, I do realize that there is less of a problem for the HE players, but I guess all of the whores will really turn these tables into rock gardens during bonus times due to the fact that they will constitute a larger proportion of the players.

On a slightly different note, Party is starting to do account specific bonuses, so I think that they are going to target the whores and starve them -- the whores kill the action at a site. Personally, I am a big fan of juicy rakeback deals. I love the one at PokerChamps that only pays you based on the money you actually put in the pot. No action, no rakeback. I imagine that rakeback at Party won't be enough to cover the losses of most of the whores.

BTW, when I say "whore", I refer to ubertight players who would be breakeven or losing players if not for the bonus. I'm OK with people jumping sites to get bonuses (I do it), but I prefer the ones who actually play poker.


Anyway, I hope that clears up my original intent.

[edited for spelling, diction, syntax, etc.]

Totally agree with you Kuso, good point well made.

Molina

Check out this at BW -- about 20 posts down.

It basically confirms what I suggested would happen at the Skins. Lotta says that the Party tables are nice and loose for NLHE (25-40% VPIP) with lots of table selection, while the Skins have limited table selection with VPIP in the teens (17% to be specific).

If the Skins get off their butt and start marketing, this _could_ have a good ending. We'll see.

I don't think there's ANY way this turns out good for the skins unless they join with another system...

I mean, you get all the wonderful crap of the Party system (stupid avatars, cartoonish annoyance, HORRIBLE SNGs) without any of the crappy Party players... huh?

Kuso's post-inebriation reflections have a lot of merit, esp the part about most true whores being losing players depending on bonus to keep them afloat. Even playing rock-tight, they aren't making money, only taking up space. Their agenda is different, their impact on the game is debatable.

I do think this situation may work out to everyone's benefit, but I have extreme doubts it will. Party has added buttons which are terrible. Blackjack and sidebets remove poker money from the poker economy and puts it in Party's pocket. As if their terrible rake structure wasn't enough.

Gonna be an interesting Monday.

CJ