I've been experimenting with another way to play this situation. I flopped an absolute monster--the nut-flush with the nut-low draw. 5 other people see a flop and it's checked to me in mid-position. Usually I would make a teaser bet. Something small enough so that the lows feel comfortable chasing and if I'm really lucky another flush will think I'm bluffing and try to run me down. Well, I decided to let it check through this time. I was hoping that the low would hit on the turn. Because of the way I played on the flop, my hand is very well concealed, making it easier to find someone with either the low or some non-nut flush who will jam with me. Does this sound sensible or fancy play syndrome? Of course, it's risky if the board pairs and the low doesn't get there. However, I think it might be worthwhile to risk that happening to increase the potential for a huge reward. Of course, in the hand in question below my plan totally backfired and it gets all f*cked up. I played the hand so weird I was totally lost on the river. I probably should have aborted on the turn and just raised the max. But what do you think about the flop check through?

Omaha Hi/Low $2-$4 PL (real money), hand #123,623,246
Table Surabaya, 13 Feb 2006 6:15 PM ET

Seat 1: Vortex2
Seat 2: pancer_kwoka
Seat 3: HotFudge1
Seat 4: _lookout_0
Seat 5: Peeniks
Seat 6: CorneliusRex [ 8D,QH,2C,AD ]
Seat 7: pittrounder
Seat 8: judgegammon
Seat 9: predator006
Seat 10: elguapo16
ANTES/BLINDS
pancer_kwoka posts blind ($2), HotFudge1 posts blind ($2).

PRE-FLOP
_lookout_0 folds, Peeniks calls $2, CorneliusRex calls $2, pittrounder calls $2, judgegammon calls $2, predator006 folds, elguapo16 folds, Vortex2 folds, pancer_kwoka checks, HotFudge1 checks.

FLOP [board cards QD,5D,7D ]
pancer_kwoka checks, HotFudge1 checks, Peeniks checks, CorneliusRex checks, pittrounder checks, judgegammon checks.

TURN [board cards QD,5D,7D,JS ]
pancer_kwoka checks, HotFudge1 checks, Peeniks bets $6, CorneliusRex calls $6, pittrounder folds, judgegammon calls $6, pancer_kwoka folds, HotFudge1 folds.

RIVER [board cards QD,5D,7D,JS,JD ]
Peeniks checks, CorneliusRex checks, judgegammon bets $15, Peeniks calls $15, CorneliusRex calls $15.

SHOWDOWN
judgegammon shows [ 5C,AS,2H,5H ]
Peeniks mucks cards
CorneliusRex mucks cards
judgegammon wins $72.

SUMMARY
Dealer: Vortex2
Pot: $75 | Rake: $3
Vortex2 loses $0
pancer_kwoka loses $2
HotFudge1 loses $2
_lookout_0 loses $0
Peeniks loses $23
CorneliusRex loses $23
pittrounder loses $2
judgegammon bets $23, collects $72, net $49
predator006 loses $0
elguapo16 loses $0

I am far from a great PLO8 player so I may be off base here but from my NLHE play I only slow play lock hands unless I have very sure someone else is going to bet my hand for me. In NL I usually leave this to floppinf top boat or better. Plus in a PL game dont you want to build a pot here?? Isnt someone with an A2 likely to call a moderate bet here?? I PLO I would call a small/ medium bet with the K or Q high flush and try to see if you how you play the turn. I think you need to build a pot unless you have an agressive player behind you.

I guess I should give some background. This was a Eurobet table that is for the most part composed of pretty solid PLO8 players working off their $600 bonus (As an aside, I finally finished up the bonus tonight and immediately cashed out. Eurobet's transition to the PokerRoom network and the opening of the $25 PLO8 tables killed what used to be juicy mid-limit PLO8 action). I know some FCP and 2+2'ers play there, although I'm not sure if any were at this particular table. Generally at that kind of table, monotone flops or flops containing hair pairs are action killers. Any large bet will make everyone fold. It's tough to make money playing in a straightforward manner, so I thought it might be worth a shot to get a little tricky.

That's why I decided betting to build a pot is reasonable, but it's too obvious. What I wanted was for the low the hit and then I would bet or raise the pot. People would't be able to tell if I'm betting a low with a weak high or messing around with the nut-flush or what. It's from this confusion that I'm hoping will generate enough additional action to justify the risk of not betting the flop. Have I convinced you of the merits yet? Or am I the one who is way off base?

i like to play these relatively fast, but it's more for metagame issues than maximizing EV in this specific hand.

i like the 1/2 to 2/3 pot bet. the reason is that i'll make the same bet when i don't have the flush but only a low draw. it really gets into people heads when i show down the low with a janky high. it gets me action in my other hands or shows me that i can steal on scary boards.

flushes are actually quite vulnerable. first, the board pairs relatively often, so that flush ain't gold. second, you end up having to chop with a low often, so that sucks, too. with two to a low on the board, i think you can get one or more lows to chase quite a bit -- and that's not even mentioning the sets. if the turn bricks, you can btp and charge the draws the maximum to see the river. if the low comes, you can also play aggressively and 3/4 the other low.

btw, i think this was a bit of FPS.



[edited to add a bit of info]

Tgoldman you make a strong arguement but you are really past my range of knowlege in PLO8, so I me saying you are right or wrong really means nothing. My gut as a poker player says that you are overthinking this one, a little case of fancy play syndrome maybe but Monk or Gooper will probably have a better answer for you.

I don't have a problem with the play, and in this case you weren't going to get the guy with bottom set and nut low draw to fold regardless. You got what you wanted, but the board didn't go along with your plan, that's all.

I think this is a case where you have to take a few different angles at it during the course of a session. 1/2 pot sometimes, check it other times, and occasionally just pot it. I'd probably be betting a 1/2 pot about 75% of the time, but then I'd jam the turn when the low didn't make it. I'd probably call the river as well, then hate myself for it.

At the $25 level you can just pot the crap out of these and at least one dope will come along looking for a low, but I think at $100 and up you have to vary it up a bit, especially in the case where you have some solid players looking to clear bonuses, as you said.

I think I'd try to build more of a pot on the turn. I'd also bet the flop but then again maybe on a tighter table your line made a nice change. I don't think calling on the river is very smart, hard to see what you can beat with a bet AND a call in there.