Question for Iceman, Unknown Player and anyone else

[Gnosis]

I"ve been playing NL for approximately a year now, and I have been wildly successfull at it. Most of my success (save the last month or so) I've done by playing tight ABC poker.

In the last month my style of play has started to change (for a variety of reasons) - More into a semi-loose style. I limp frequently with AK, sometimes I raise with it, once in a while I limp pop. I play hands like 108s: I limp with them, call raises, I open for a raise with it, you get me in the right situation I'll re-raise with it. (Note I've been playing on PS where I have a little more room for creative play). Now once the flop comes I'm still play tight, but if I feel bottom pair (for whatever reason) is the best hand, I'll let the guy bluff at it until the river and hopefully he doesn't catch. Overall I think I have excellent hand reading skills....

My question is this: do you (ever) play like this? And if you know someone is playing like this how do you make adustments for such a player? (I'm asking this as I want to know what type of counter strategies I might run up against)

EDIT:
One last note, I've seen a bit of a dip in my hoursly win raite, however I can justify this as I'm still working out the kinks of playing this way. Hoever my hourly has been improving since I started and I figure if things continue I should surpass my old expected win rate sometime in January.

[TheUnknownPlayer]

Gnosis,

Tight ABC no-limit poker in the current climate will make you wildly successful as you've noted. The great news is that your success implies that you've got ABC down correctly - many people feel they are playing the same way and are losing - their version of tight ABC and mine are different. This type of play as you've correctly surmised, is not the way to maximized profits - but you've got to have it down before you move on to what you're trying now.

I play very loose before the flop, particularly in passive games where I am unlikely to see a raise - and it is correct to do so as long as one has the skill to play very well post-flop (which requires, amongst other things, an ability to put an opponent on a hand accurately). Let's say that I am playing a NL game with $2/$5 blinds and a $300 max buy-in. If I and two other opponents have over $1000 in front of us and I play much better than the other two - what hand could I possibly have that doesn't justify a $5 pre-flop call when I am getting 200:1 implied odds? Again, this style doesn't work for everyone - you've got to play extremely well post-flop. Ultimately though, everything in poker is situation dependent - eventually, to master this game, you have to get away from thinking in terms of "I have T8s in MP and the book says to fold". At the highest levels - this game is art - the rules fall away and it becomes a blend of knowledge and intuition. Reading your post - I got the impression that you're probably ready to move beyond ABC,

As far as how to adjust to someone playing this style... 'know thyself'. How do you get trapped when you're playing like this? Personally, I tend to trap people by playing much more passively against them post-flop then I normally would, allowing them to take the lead and hang themselves but for each opponent there is an optimal way to take them down.

One further note... many a great and talented player has fallen victim to the idea that because they are so darn good - they can play a few more hands profitably...which they can. And so they decide that they can play a few more...which they might. And so they decide that they can play a few more...which they can't. When their profits start dipping, they assume that it is short term fluctuations, which it may or may not be. If they've crossed the line of profitable play then it won't get better - but many delude themselves all the way to the rail. I do think your doing fine - but its something to be aware of.

TUP

[Gnosis]

TUP,

Thanks for the time put into your reply, it is much appreciated.

I am being very cautious of "Fancy Play Syndrome", and that getting a good handle on style being discussed is something that is much harder, complicated, and in need of constant self-review. (To be honest, this is 1/2 the reason why I'm changing).

When you mentioned that the game is more art at the higher levels (I've heard that statement before), but I reflected on the why and when of my change. I started playing in a "large" (for the area) NL game. The game is an open buy-in with $1/$2 blinds - with most people buying in around $100. Initially I crushed the game and people started to figure me out and my profits dropped. So I started mixing up my play a little bit and started trusting my reads more and my win rate improved. But along with it, the oddest thing happen. I no longer had got an intense, testosterone charge from playing. Instead the game had a soothing, comfortable flow to them. Everything just seems to move in slow motion, and is very clear. A big win or loss, weren't affecting me like they use to. Instead every hand changes the dynamic at the table, some hands more so than others.

The thing about this sensation, is it is familiar to me - I've experience the same feeling when I'm in the middle of a long programming session or when I'm in kitchen cooking something new. Honestly - its a better feeling than sex (I can usually make it last longer ). It's a psychological phenomenon called "flow". The best book I found on the subject is here: . It is worth your time to read.

[tetsuo]

When you talk about that sensation when programming, I do know what you mean lol.

Quite often I am posed an architectural problem. And I just sit there and think of nothing. Quite confidently. And the person posing the question will be like 'WTF are you doing?' and I'll just sit there and say 'Just hang on a minute'.

Then I get this strange kind of 'lateral' feeling, a kind of 'widening' of the mind, and before you know it I'm coming out with a beautifully elegant solution - and I haven't even really 'thought' about it. It's like all my experience has been brought to bear subconciously.

If that's 'flow', it's a beautiful thing, my man. Now all I have to do is to get it with poker (don't wait up).

[Gnosis]

Ya, thats flow. I'm assuming when TUP plays, and what I'm striving for comes from the same place. When your playing in that space - tilt is gone, the highs you are use to now are gone....just this very mild constant euphoric state.

Speaking of programming, There are several professional backgrounds that I've noticed that seem highly suitable for poker. Programmers being one of them - Programmers are naturally very good with numbers, and good creative thinkers and are comfortable and in "touch" with flow. Watch Chris "Jesus" Ferguson (sp) or Paul Phillips play.

The other one is cops (like iceman5) or military personal - Their training teaches them a highly disciplined following of procedures - which provides them every possible advantage - and they relentless "attach" when they have the upper hand (bet raise, re-raise), however they can spot when the situation has changed and retreat/regroup and find a better situation (fold). Cops also tend to read people well.

Now the ultimate playing style is a hybrid of everything I've describe and few players in the world have it are the top notch in everything- Gus Hansen, Daniel N. are a couple.

Ok I've read a lot of psychology/sociology books, sue me.

[rdale]