In hand 2, I also really like the turn check raise, but its not a play I'd use often. My position relative to the bettor and the player on a draw, coupled with my certainty that the MP player would bet the turn if checked to were the only reason I'd try this. If I'd had any doubt about whether he'd bet, I would have led again. The additional benefits of playing the hand the way I did were two fold. First, with the pot as large as it was, it was difficult for me to remove the drawer's odds. But check raising the turn got me as close to ruining them as possible, always a positive. Really, the only thing I was worried about in the hand was a diamond hitting, or a jack. Another benefit, looking back in hindsight, is the possibility that the MP player may realize that he's behind and slow down on the turn. Had I bet, MP called, and then the LP just called, the MP player would have had correct odds to draw, which is a situation we get into all the time in limit. The river completing a runner-runner flush didn't concern me. If it turned out that MP was drawing to a straight and hit runner-runner flush, then good for him. But I wasn't going to back down on the river with potentially two extra bets coming.
In hand 3, I screwed the pooch. I've been playing too much Omaha and forgot that in Hold em, the nuts isn't always out. I remember that I had convinced myself on the turn that he had to have Jacks and almost folded. Obviously he's never going to fold, so there's no way I can win the hand, but I did back down pretty quickly. I was quite sure he didn't have queens, due to the lack of a pre-flop raise. It seemed unlikely that he'd have jacks also because he didn't raise pre-flop, but I limp with Jacks occaisionally, so I couldn't fully rule it out.
Hand 4 I thought I might have mangled the hand. I still can't decide if I backed down too soon, or not soon enough. I slowed down when I did for a few reasons. First, the pot was sufficiently large, second the maniac was clearly not slowing down. He's telling me that he's got some peice of the flop and thus isn't going anywhere. The trouble is, I don't know how much of the flop he's got. Does he have a set, two pair, a straight, one pair and a straight draw, a pair and a flush draw? Who knows. All of those are potential trouble. Additionally, my hand, while nice, is vulnerable. If the board pairs, a flush or straigh card comes, or an overcard comes, my hand will be in jeopardy and I have no idea which cards hurt me because I'm up against a maniac. So basically, half the deck is going to slow me down on the river anyway, so I might as well slow down now. The additional problem is the presence of the third player in the hand, just calling, further increasing the danger to me on the river. Basically I was trying to lose a little less when I lost the pot and win a little less the times I win, but that may be weak reasoning.
Statistics: Posted by Drade — Thu Mar 10, 2005 2:02 pm
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I like hand 2 a lot. You made it 2 big bets on the turn to the guy drawing.
Hand 3 I wouldn't have backed off so soon. Without a preflop raise it's pretty unlikely that UTG has JJ or QQ, which are the only hands that beat you. He's much more likely to have QT, JT, KQ, or maybe even 89 or 9T or KT.
Hand 4 I'd have called down too.
Statistics: Posted by Nortonesque — Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:21 pm
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Hand 2, the check-raise on the turn is good, I think. That 4 is probably a nice card for you on the turn in case you were up against two pair, though in this case, it didn't wind up mattering. Of course, I'm a bit weak at times, so I may have check-called the river, fearing that MP made his flush.
Hand 3, I think calling on the flop was correct after UTG 3-bet, but I think on the turn, I'd cap it it, and call if UTG continues to raise on the river. If your feeling was that UTG wouldn't 3-bet you without a boat, though, then I guess going into the shell was right.
Hand 4, I don't think I'd play any differently. WIth that much in the pot, the river is a call against a maniac, albeit a reluctant one. And hand 5 seems pretty straightforward, other than that it shows your opponent certainly was quite a maniac.
Just my thoughts
-TW
Statistics: Posted by TightWad — Wed Mar 09, 2005 12:25 pm
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Hand 1 : This hand occured at the Taj. UTG and the BB are players I know well. They're both pretty loose and aggressive, but they play well. I'm dealt
![[As]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/As.gif "The Ace of Spades")
![[Ks]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Ks.gif "The King of Spades")
UTG+1. I've been running this table over and am up significantly. UTG raises, I three bet, one horrid MP player cold calls, the BB calls, as does UTG. The flop is ![[3s]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/3s.gif "The Three of Spades")
![[6s]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/6s.gif "The Six of Spades")
![[7h]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/7h.gif "The Seven of Hearts")
. The BB bets, UTG raises... what would you do? I three bet. As expected the horrid MP player folded and the BB capped. UTG and I both called. The turn was ![[Js]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Js.gif "The Jack of Spades")
. The BB bet, UTG called, I raised and the both called. The river was ![[Qd]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Qd.gif "The Queen of Diamonds")
, BB check called, UTG folded and I won a huge pot. The BB flashed me ![[4d]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/4d.gif "The Four of Diamonds")
![[5d]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/5d.gif "The Five of Diamonds")
before pitching them into the muck. Hand 2 : Also at the Taj. The BB and UTG are gone now and the table is getting tired of my aggressive play. In EP I'm dealt
![[Kd]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Kd.gif "The King of Diamonds")
and raise. 4 players call as does the BB. The flop is ![[Jc]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Jc.gif "The Jack of Clubs")
![[Td]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Td.gif "The Ten of Diamonds")
. The BB checks, I bet, one player calls and then the next raises. That folds off the rest of the field back to me. I raise, MP calls and the raiser caps. We all call. The turn is the ![[4c]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/4c.gif "The Four of Clubs")
. I check, MP checks, the raiser bets, I raise, the MP calls, as does the raiser. The river was a harmless ![[6c]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/6c.gif "The Six of Clubs")
. I bet, MP folds, and the LP calls. He shows me ![[Kh]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Kh.gif "The King of Hearts")
![[Jd]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Jd.gif "The Jack of Diamonds")
. Hand 3 : 5/10 Bad beat tables on Party. Same loose-aggressive style as the Taj. I'm dealt
![[Th]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Th.gif "The Ten of Hearts")
in the BB. UTG calls, as do two other players. The SB completes and I check. The flop is ![[Ts]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Ts.gif "The Ten of Spades")
![[Jh]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Jh.gif "The Jack of Hearts")
![[Qs]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Qs.gif "The Queen of Spades")
. The SB bets, I raise and UTG three bets. The field folds off back to the SB who calls. What would you do? I elected to call. The turn was the . I checked, UTG bet, the SB called and I raised. UTG three bets and the SB folds. What would you do now? At this point I decided to get to check-call to get to the river as cheaply as possible. At showdown we split the pot when UTG shows the same hand as me. Hand 4 : Still 5/10 on Party. There's a true maniac at this table. He's in LP. He plays every hand, cold calling any number of bets, then he caps the flop. It's bizarre. Even more bizarre is that he's actually up since he sat down. Anyway, he's butted horns with me a few times. He's won twice and I've won twice, but I've made more from him. Still, I can tell he's going to play against me every pot as some sort of macho pissing contest. I'm dealt
and Raise in MP. Maniac calls as does the button. The flop was ![[3c]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/3c.gif "The Three of Clubs")
![[5c]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/5c.gif "The Five of Clubs")
. I bet, Maniac raises, the button called, I three bet, and the maniac capped and the button and I both called. The turn was . I bet, the maniac raised, the button called and I called. The river was ![[2d]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/2d.gif "The Two of Diamonds")
. I checked, the maniac bet, the button folded and I called. I was reasonably sure I was beat, but it's hard to fold to maniac just because a scare card hits. Alas, I was beat. He had ![[Ah]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Ah.gif "The Ace of Hearts")
. Hand 5 : Just 2 hands later I'm dealt
![[Ac]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Ac.gif "The Ace of Clubs")
![[Ad]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Ad.gif "The Ace of Diamonds")
and raise in EP. The maniac calls, as do both blinds. The flop was ![[Tc]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Tc.gif "The Ten of Clubs")
![[8h]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/8h.gif "The Eight of Hearts")
. The BB bet, I raised, the maniac three bet, the SB folded, the BB called, I capped and they both called. the turn was ![[Kc]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/Kc.gif "The King of Clubs")
. The BB checked, I bet, the maniac raised, the BB folded, I three bet and the maniac called. The river was the ![[4h]](https://livepokerforum.com/images/smilies/4h.gif "The Four of Hearts")
, I bet and the maniac called and I won a solid pot. I have no idea what the maniac had this hand, perhaps A-3o again. There are some odd plays in here, like the turn check-raise with an overpair in Hand two, but there were reasons that I'll get into if there's interest. They may be the wrong reasons, but still reasons.
Drade
Statistics: Posted by Drade — Wed Mar 09, 2005 11:59 am
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