If you keep trying to convince yourself that you have to play to justify the amount of hours you've put into the game I guess you will return to it in future, but I really can't see any good coming from that. Honestly, everything you've said so far is 100% classic words of someone who MIGHT develop a serious gambling problem. I really don't think poker is for you, even if you are obviously an erudite and intelligent person.
Hope this helps, best of luck for the future!
Monk
Statistics: Posted by Felonius_Monk — Sat Mar 11, 2006 10:50 am
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One gift I have though is that I am fairly good at scrutinizing myself. I know that I can play quite good poker and very good heads-up poker but that I don't have the right discipline or mindset at all. I guess I really should quit but still, I've put in a lot of hours into this game. So, I have not ruled it out to give this another try later on in the future but my mindset/attitude must change drastically before I try again. Swings of about $1000 with an equally large bankroll is _never going to lead to any winnings.
I've also noticed that poker really can "consume" you in a bad way. I easily play longer sessions than what I had in mind when I started and I also find that I use time for unproductive poker related things such as watching "poker shows" or railbirding a high stakes cash table.
But maybe I'll be back in a couple of months after long sessions of contemplation and meditation.
Or is it the case that some players just never can become winning players in the long run (even if they know the game farily well, are well read, and not stupid)? What do you think?
Great foum anyway! Keep it up!
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Sat Mar 11, 2006 9:23 am
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The bad new is that I played heads-up, too high for my bankroll.
The good new is that I won 2 buy-ins.
The bad news is that I got outdrawn by two outers and AQs vs AA all-in pre-flop.
The good new is that I didn't get tilted at all because of it.
The great news is that I'm up for the day.
I still don't like the fact that I played heads-up though. But otherwise, I do feel that grinding (especially with a good sized bankroll) sort of nullifies the longing for fast action.
By the way, I have a good tip for improving your game. Keep a log where you write down the errors you make after you've played a hand wrong. Quite soon you start to become very aware about what errors you are doing again and again and can correct them!
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And todays hand! What would you have done on the turn and what if the opponent goes all-in? He is extremely loose, fishy and an aggressive player.
- me sitting in seat 1 with $140.20
- thaa sitting in seat 2 with $43.80
- JAMMY_DODGER sitting in seat 3 with $29.80
- DevilsFriend sitting in seat 4 with $132.55 [Dealer]
- winnum sitting in seat 5 with $107.90
- WendelClark sitting in seat 6 with $51.30
winnum posted the small blind - $0.50
WendelClark posted the big blind - $1.00
** Dealing card to me: King of Clubs, King of Hearts
me raised - $4.00
thaa folded
JAMMY_DODGER folded
DevilsFriend called - $4.00
winnum folded
WendelClark folded
** Dealing the flop: 3 of Clubs, 5 of Diamonds, 5 of Clubs
me bet - $7.00
DevilsFriend raised - $14.00
me raised - $32.00
DevilsFriend called - $32.00
** Dealing the turn: 8 of Clubs
??
Enjoy!
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:22 pm
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On that hand when u had AA and re-raised to $64....i would have played it way different.
You had it heads up. Why not just call his re-raise then c/r all in on the flop. This will give u a MUCH better chance to scoop his stack. Especially, if the player is the type to lay down KK,QQ or AK for that matter.
Statistics: Posted by Zuccala — Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:20 pm
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1 February
5,5h
+$106
3 tables
NL 100 SH
How would you play AA here? This situation doesn't come up too often but when it does it's definately sweet indeed.Maybe I should have gone all-in? I'm representing extreme strength the way I play.
Or maybe even flat call. Is this really a move with a good hand or someone on tilt? Or both?
- RAB1967 sitting in seat 1 with $91.64
- onlyme33 sitting in seat 2 with $35.69
- butcher18 sitting in seat 3 with $119.32 [Sitting out]
- Spathi sitting in seat 4 with $72.13
- me sitting in seat 5 with $276.76
- rad1977 sitting in seat 6 with $13.32 [Dealer]
- canaryjim sitting in seat 7 with $122.60
- PontLa-mera sitting in seat 8 with $99.00
canaryjim posted the small blind - $0.50
PontLa-mera posted the big blind - $1.00
** Dealing card to me: Ace of Spades, Ace of Hearts
RAB1967 called - $1.00
onlyme33 folded
Spathi folded
me raised - $4.00
rad1977 folded
canaryjim raised - $18.00
PontLa-mera folded
RAB1967 folded
me raised - $64.00
canaryjim folded
me mucks: Ace of Spades, Ace of Hearts
me wins $84.00 from the main pot
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And finally, one of my sickest calls ever. The way he was steaming I actually fancy my play. But it's still sick.
- porpe sitting in seat 1 with $97.58
- Jack55 sitting in seat 2 with $100.00
- me sitting in seat 3 with $101.80 [Dealer]
- staffyPL sitting in seat 4 with $89.08
- zeubalomu sitting in seat 5 with $468.14
- kisenx sitting in seat 6 with $48.50 [Sitting out]
staffyPL posted the small blind - $0.50
zeubalomu posted the big blind - $1.00
** Dealing card to me: Jack of Diamonds, King of Hearts
porpe folded
Jack55 folded
me raised - $4.00
staffyPL folded
zeubalomu raised - $13.00
me called - $13.00
** Dealing the flop: Jack of Hearts, 9 of Diamonds, 7 of Diamonds
zeubalomu bet - $94.00
kisenx was disconnected
me went all-in - $88.80
zeubalomu shows: 9 of Hearts, Ace of Hearts
** Dealing the turn: 5 of Clubs
** Dealing the river: 2 of Diamonds
me wins $202.10 from the main pot
Enjoy!
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:34 pm
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I have a feeling I'm too loose in the sb, any other comments?
The stats are from different limits (I think) so the actual amount of dollars won is probably not interesting.
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Wed Feb 01, 2006 2:52 am
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5,3h
-$26
3 tables
NL 50 SH
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Wed Jan 25, 2006 4:21 pm
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Statistics: Posted by Xaston — Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:10 pm
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-Jus
Statistics: Posted by Juskimo — Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:05 pm
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1) The fact that you just lost 3 stacks due to bad cards has no bearing on your future cards. Stopping the session just because you've been running bad so far is silly, as you are just as likely to start running hot as you are to continue running bad.
2) Poker is about making money. The way you make money is by making bets with a positive expected value repeatedly. Having KK run into AA twice just now has no bearing on the likely EV of your future wave of cards.
In theory of course. In practice this is simply not true for several reasons.
1) When you're losing, people are more likely to take shots at you. When you're losing your continuation bets are going to get called and raised more. That's bad.
2) When you're losing you may go on tilt if you are a person. Going on tilt causes you to make -EV bets you wouldn't make if you were not on tilt. -EV bets are more often than not going to sink you deeper rather than turning your session around.
Having a stop loss may work to help in these regards. It depends greatly on how observant your opponents are (secondary influence, and probably negligible at $50 NL since most of those guys aren't paying attention) and what it takes to make you go on tilt. Some people need to lose X hands. Some people need to lose Y stacks. Some people need to lose Z dollars. If it's the last one a stop loss is perfect, you simply stop playing when you've lost Z dollars. If it's losing X hands you may have a problem, because it's very possible you will go on tilt way before your stop loss kicks in.
As Juskimo mentioned, I personally don't have a stop loss.
1) I consider myself to be an emotionally stable player (although lately I'm beginning to suspect I have more work to go in this aspect than I thought) so I think I'm generally still +EV in games even after dropping a tidy sum.
2) I'm not a TAG most of the time, I'm a LAG. In poker you make money most often when you are playing counter to what your image is. That is to say Dan Harrington's EV with AA is relatively low, since people give him so much credit for having a good hand. However because of this when he has a not so good hand and he is bluffing/semi-bluffing, he is very likely to get away with it (bluffing, being making a bet with a hand that in essence doesn't deserve to have much money in the pot, which is counter to what Dan's image is). On the other hand, Gus Hansen, who is considered a loose aggressive bluffer has a VERY high EV with AA, because frankly whenever he enters a pot people think he has rags. Conversely, when he is playing those rags (same as his image) he is less likely to get away with the bluff than Dan would, because people expect Gus to be bluffing with rags. As such a TAG loses more by losing than a LAG. A TAG that has just lost a significant amount of money is going to be percieved by his opponents as likely to be on tilt. He will now have a much lower EV on his bluffs than he did before, because people now think that he IS bluffing. A LAG that has just lost a decent chunk of change is again suspected to be on tilt, however this almost works to his advantage. As a LAG you will make a lot of money with your big hands because people never suspect you have them, and when they think you're on tilt (just make sure you really aren't) they give you even less credit. The amount of action a losing (not in the long term, EV sense, but in this given session) LAG gets is very significant and will often greatly increase the players EV if he keeps a level head.
Statistics: Posted by Xaston — Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:10 pm
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24 January 2006
6h
+$70
3 tables
NL 50 SH
- Gummer sitting in seat 1 with $47.45 [Dealer]
- Hamman12 sitting in seat 2 with $77.90
- NarQ sitting in seat 3 with $23.30
- Jorg199 sitting in seat 4 with $37.50
- essse sitting in seat 5 with $58.21
- me sitting in seat 6 with $50.00
Hamman12 posted the small blind - $0.25
NarQ posted the big blind - $0.50
** Dealing card to me: Queen of Clubs, Queen of Hearts
Jorg199 folded
essse raised - $2.00
me raised - $6.50
Gummer called - $6.50
Hamman12 folded
NarQ folded
essse called - $6.50
** Dealing the flop: 8 of Clubs, 4 of Hearts, 4 of Diamonds
essse checked
me bet - $15.00
Gummer called - $15.00
essse went all-in - $51.71
me went all-in - $28.50
Gummer went all-in - $25.95
Gummer shows: Ace of Clubs, Ace of Spades
essse shows: King of Clubs, King of Diamonds
** Dealing the turn: 7 of Clubs
** Dealing the river: King of Spades
essse wins $140.10 from the main pot
essse wins $145.20 from side pot 1
(Gummer is a calling station.)
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- gasfitter sitting in seat 1 with $30.56 [Dealer]
- lm1985 sitting in seat 2 with $61.12
- _TC_ sitting in seat 3 with $48.70
- Stojan76 sitting in seat 4 with $49.00
- mrvin111 sitting in seat 5 with $18.75
- me sitting in seat 6 with $56.20
lm1985 posted the small blind - $0.25
_TC_ posted the big blind - $0.50
** Dealing card to me: Ace of Diamonds, King of Hearts
Stojan76 folded
mrvin111 folded
me raised - $2.00
gasfitter called - $2.00
lm1985 raised - $8.25
_TC_ folded
me called - $8.25
gasfitter folded
** Dealing the flop: 10 of Clubs, 6 of Clubs, King of Spades
lm1985 checked
me checked
** Dealing the turn: 10 of Hearts
lm1985 bet - $10.50
me called - $10.50
** Dealing the river: 2 of Spades
lm1985 bet - $24.00
me folded
lm1985 mucks:
lm1985 wins $62.00 from the main pot
Last time lm1985 checked the flop being the pre flop raiser he later sprung to life and seemed to have good cards. Here I put him on AA/KK/AK
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- mrmikkke sitting in seat 1 with $60.87
- noop sitting in seat 2 with $68.02
- Naily1 sitting in seat 3 with $25.23
- Caddy87 sitting in seat 4 with $77.75 [Dealer]
- nilsjo11 sitting in seat 5 with $70.20
- me sitting in seat 6 with $74.65
nilsjo11 posted the small blind - $0.25
me posted the big blind - $0.50
** Dealing card to me: 6 of Spades, 7 of Spades
mrmikkke folded
noop raised - $1.00
Naily1 folded
Caddy87 called - $1.00
nilsjo11 raised - $1.50
me called - $1.50
noop called - $1.50
Caddy87 called - $1.50
** Dealing the flop: 9 of Spades, 8 of Hearts, 3 of Clubs
nilsjo11 bet - $0.50
me called - $0.50
noop called - $0.50
Caddy87 folded
** Dealing the turn: 8 of Spades
nilsjo11 bet - $0.50
me raised - $7.00
noop folded
nilsjo11 called - $7.00
** Dealing the river: 2 of Hearts
nilsjo11 checked
me checked
me shows: 6 of Spades, 7 of Spades
nilsjo11 shows: 6 of Hearts, 6 of Diamonds
nilsjo11 wins $20.45 from the main pot
Enjoy!
Statistics: Posted by the_last_chance — Tue Jan 24, 2006 5:55 pm
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Leaving the table also gives you time to reflect for a bit. I started a habit of spending that time going over the session in PT. Initially, it was just to record the bad beats so I could bitch about them, but it doesn't take very long before you come to see patterns. Maybe it happens when a guy outplays you and takes a pot down with K high. Maybe its suffering two beats from the same guy in quick succession. Maybe its a psychological thing when you're down 2 full buyins. Whatever it might be, once you see yourself disintegrating often enough, you also come to recognize it while you're in the process. I rarely go on tilt now, although I still respect my stop loss limits. But I do see the day when I won't have to without lying to myself.
Also, Jus said it best. The advice people post here is usually solid and its always with the intention of helping you. You should at least think it over carefully before deciding to ignore it.
Statistics: Posted by redhouse — Mon Jan 23, 2006 3:40 am
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Statistics: Posted by shamdonk — Mon Jan 23, 2006 12:14 am
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