Just read about this hand example and was wondering what you guys think about this example. I don't know if the spread is important but I'll use their example it's a 30/60 game.

A player from EP opens with a raise and we call with , we get a caller behind us and the big blind calls. $260 in the pot with 4 players flop is .

Big blind bets, the PF raiser calls we raise, the player behind us folds, the BB 3 bets it, and the original PF raiser folds. now there's $470 in the pot and we're HU.

Turn is and the BB leads out again. what's your play?

call down.

I am probably beat, but I am not folding TPTK here. I have a few outs against AJ, and I am beating any other AX combo (except A3). A set has me in bade shape here.

But I surely dont play 30/60 (unless you've misplaced a decimal point)

I agree. I hate the cold call pre-flop, but I thouht you wanted to know what we do from the turn bet on.

Cal,

What does a turn raise get us? We are not sure where we stand here, and all it does it make it more expensive to get to showdown. We may have outs if we are behind, lets get to showdown as cheaply as possible and call this down.

I think its important you mention 30/60 here. I don't think this hand plays this way at lower limits because too many players at those limits are too involved in making plays at the pot and ignore what (once you repeat the analysis) is really straightforward betting of 2pair or a set. I stated on another thread (and here) that at lower limits too many folks chase anything with garbage. I can tell you that after playing live today and just getting pummelled in one of those no-fold'em nightmares, I can tell you many of my biggest mistakes were putting my opponents on 'bluffs' or semi-bluffs ( He' doesn't have the overpair he's representing'...or second or third pair will be good'...) when they had better hands and basically ignoring rather straightforward betting. It's pretty terrible calling down hands where you are way behind (TPBK vs 2pair or trips with TK vs full boat made with case x and garbage kicker pairing). I don't mind calling down when I'm 'walking the dog'.....I just hate being the 'dog'. In editing this I realize that last night, at least, I became one of those people, and paid for it.

Given the above Antneye may be right about not raising the turn for value. But if I believe I'm beaten in this hand then I haven't enough outs to justify chasing. If he has AJ I'm dead to a K, If he has A3 I'm a little better off but not much. 33 and JJ leave us dead to an A, the pot just isn't that big. If I'm laying down the best hand it won't be the first time and (based on recent results ) it probably won't be the last. Maybe I need to learn to 'lay down' a few more hands rather than being the aggressive defender I have been.