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AA Weak or No?

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AA Weak or No?

Postby Pok 7's » Fri Feb 02, 2007 12:16 am

Same table as my other hand I posted. "Frazer17" was one who went all the way to the river in a 13BB pot then folded. No reads on him yet, (HUD comes up after 25 hands). After I stopped playing with him I only had 40 hands but his numbers were 67.5/2.5./0.70. Never really saw him make any moves, but I happened to catch a quick run of good hands since I was at this table and showed down most of them. For the time I was there I was esily the most aggressive player, USUALLY a line like his isn't done with TPTK at a table that appeared to be very passive. Something smelled more like a set, 2 pair, or even the str8 here. After seeing him play some hands after this I didn't peg him as someone who would make a move playing a draw.

Wondeing if I should've just called down (looking back I'm thinking maybe I should've). Is it just me or does anytime someone lays down AA always wonder if it was the wrong move? But then when they don't fold them under similar situations always wish they did :? .

Holdem Limit $1/$2
[Feb 2 02:46:13] : Hand Start.

[Feb 2 02:46:13] : Hero is the dealer.
[Feb 2 02:46:13] : throx posted small blind.
[Feb 2 02:46:15] : frazer17 posted big blind.
[Feb 2 02:46:15] : Game [261801] started with 5 players.
[Feb 2 02:46:15] : Dealing Hole Cards.
[Feb 2 02:46:15] : Seat 1 : Hero has [Ad] [As]
[Feb 2 02:46:33] : paddygood called $1
[Feb 2 02:46:34] : Mister Nuts folded.
[Feb 2 02:46:36] : Hero raised
[Feb 2 02:46:38] : throx folded.
[Feb 2 02:46:39] : frazer17 called $1
[Feb 2 02:46:40] : paddygood called $1
[Feb 2 02:46:40] : Dealing flop.
[Feb 2 02:46:40] : Board cards [7h] [Jd] [8h]
[Feb 2 02:46:48] : frazer17 checked.
[Feb 2 02:46:49] : paddygood checked.
[Feb 2 02:46:51] : Hero bet
[Feb 2 02:46:52] : frazer17 called $1
[Feb 2 02:46:54] : paddygood called $1
[Feb 2 02:46:54] : Dealing turn.
[Feb 2 02:46:54] : Board cards [7h] [Jd] [8h] [5d]
[Feb 2 02:46:58] : frazer17 bet $2
[Feb 2 02:46:59] : paddygood called $2
[Feb 2 02:47:01] : Hero raised
[Feb 2 02:47:03] : frazer17 3 bets
[Feb 2 02:47:05] : paddygood folded.
[Feb 2 02:47:07] : Hero folded.
[Feb 2 02:47:08] : frazer17 wins $18.75 as the last player standing
[Feb 2 02:47:11] : Hand is over.
Last edited by Pok 7's on Fri Feb 02, 2007 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby bassline » Fri Feb 02, 2007 4:39 am

Rough hand. I would probably would have called the turn and the river as well with the pot size.
Against such passivness though you could
call the turn and hope for a cheap showdown if some flush draw aka scare card appears and villains shuts down.
Or fold the turn as you did.
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Postby MecosKing » Fri Feb 02, 2007 4:57 am

Im a propnent of this fold. Good fold.
NorthViewBTP: poor old ED
NorthViewBTP: from gun totin beer swiller
NorthViewBTP: to limp wristed defender of fagdom
NorthViewBTP: ALL THINGS TO ALL MEN
NorthViewBTP: IS THE SAME AS NO THINGS TO ANY MAN
--------------------
Mekos King: NV ignoring
Jimmy BTP: he's ignoring me too
Jimmy BTP: obv fell asleep in his colostomy bag
Jimmy BTP: running shite everywhere
---------
neelguru: I gave up politics when I was 6
neelguru: Im dedicating the rest of my life to getting unstuck
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Postby redhouse » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:39 am

Mekos King: existence without running good
Mekos King: truly has no purpose
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Postby antneye » Fri Feb 02, 2007 9:05 am

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Postby Schuster » Fri Feb 02, 2007 1:35 pm

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Postby antneye » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:48 pm

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Postby MecosKing » Fri Feb 02, 2007 9:28 pm

NorthViewBTP: poor old ED
NorthViewBTP: from gun totin beer swiller
NorthViewBTP: to limp wristed defender of fagdom
NorthViewBTP: ALL THINGS TO ALL MEN
NorthViewBTP: IS THE SAME AS NO THINGS TO ANY MAN
--------------------
Mekos King: NV ignoring
Jimmy BTP: he's ignoring me too
Jimmy BTP: obv fell asleep in his colostomy bag
Jimmy BTP: running shite everywhere
---------
neelguru: I gave up politics when I was 6
neelguru: Im dedicating the rest of my life to getting unstuck
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Postby antneye » Fri Feb 02, 2007 9:37 pm

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Postby growlers » Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:49 am

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Postby MecosKing » Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:33 am

The raise wasnt for a free showdown- im sorry but 578J with a running flushdraw coming out there is just not enough of a scare board to justify just calling with an OP. Yeah maybe hed have CRed with KJ or something, but if he had you smashed from the get go with like 77, maybe hed have CRed too. An OESD and a second FD just got there on the turn, a turn card which mind you, was VERY unlikely to actually improve his hand (64, 96. doubful, but possible with that VP, which is why we test him) and here he comes firing. ALso remember this is SHLHE, a mizors game...Hes gonna have to do more than fire that turn to convince me that im beat here..

Not raising this turn is an example of 'not playin an overpair hard enough on the turn syndrome' and to be quite honest, its a beginners mistake...At least it was for me- the first year or so i played LHE (maybe longer even) i was very disinclined to put in turn raises with OPs or TPTKs because i was always like 'Well the mizor prolly has a decent idea of that i got and hes firing anyway, so theres a good chance im beat here i just call.'

Thats wrong. Now if the board was a scary straight/2pair board lke JKQ8 or 9TJ5 or some such nonsense, then calling is fine. This board really just doesnt have me convinced, not yet anyways... just calling here is not only not another valid way to play this hand, but it is actually a serious mistake, on the same level as not firing the turn with KK when the board is 66Q9 and you get checked to because your afraid that an unlikely 6 might checkraise you. (all IMHO of course....... :P )

And yeah, not folding to this threebet is a mistake too, absent a read of course..

Dont forget, when your evaluating a hand like this that LHE is a game of BBs/100, and an extra BB here puts you one more BB/100 ahead -- thats the difference between a hundred hands at 0.5bb/100 and 1.5bb/100, and thats a huge fucking difference. you cant just look at this and be like meh both ways to play it are fine, because they arent- one gets you an extra BB when your ahead and loses the same when your not, and in LHE, that is a big deal.
Last edited by MecosKing on Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
NorthViewBTP: poor old ED
NorthViewBTP: from gun totin beer swiller
NorthViewBTP: to limp wristed defender of fagdom
NorthViewBTP: ALL THINGS TO ALL MEN
NorthViewBTP: IS THE SAME AS NO THINGS TO ANY MAN
--------------------
Mekos King: NV ignoring
Jimmy BTP: he's ignoring me too
Jimmy BTP: obv fell asleep in his colostomy bag
Jimmy BTP: running shite everywhere
---------
neelguru: I gave up politics when I was 6
neelguru: Im dedicating the rest of my life to getting unstuck
User avatar
MecosKing
Juffins FTW
 
Posts: 3715
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:42 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Postby Xaston » Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:39 am

Boy, you got me confused with a man who repeats himself.
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Postby MecosKing » Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:42 am

NorthViewBTP: poor old ED
NorthViewBTP: from gun totin beer swiller
NorthViewBTP: to limp wristed defender of fagdom
NorthViewBTP: ALL THINGS TO ALL MEN
NorthViewBTP: IS THE SAME AS NO THINGS TO ANY MAN
--------------------
Mekos King: NV ignoring
Jimmy BTP: he's ignoring me too
Jimmy BTP: obv fell asleep in his colostomy bag
Jimmy BTP: running shite everywhere
---------
neelguru: I gave up politics when I was 6
neelguru: Im dedicating the rest of my life to getting unstuck
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Posts: 3715
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2005 4:42 pm
Location: Los Angeles, California

Postby Pok 7's » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:56 am

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Postby DoctorHandles » Sat Feb 03, 2007 6:05 pm

The better player should win the race. Always.
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