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Short Stack experiment - Live Poker Forums

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Short Stack experiment

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Short Stack experiment

Postby iceman5 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:19 am

I decided to try this short stack experiment and see what happens. If you dont know what Im talking about, you can start by reading this thread
forum/viewtopic.php?t=11359

Im playing $100NL and starting with $30 at each table. For the most part, Im just pushing all in with JJ+ and AK / AQ. I am making a few adjustments and pushing in with a few more hands if there is a limper or 2, because they hardly ever call and I can steal the limp money. I also only play beyond the flop when Im am in the blinds and Im already in the pot. If I double up, I change tables but since I have $60 or more, I play the last round like I normally would if I had a full stack.

Im trying to play 8 tables, but its not easy on 1 monitor. Here are my stats so far. I may try this for 30 mins to an hour a day and see what happens.

Ive been called 5 out of 24 times.
Won 4
Lost 0
Split 1

Lost one $30 stack from the BB on a big outdraw after flopping 2 pair.

419 hands
+87.15
10.40PTBBs
3.97 MT rate
$56.84 / hr.

This could be interesting if its done correctly. The player at PokerRoom who plays a short stack strategy and inspired this experiment (and is referenced in the linked thread) is not playing a correct short stack strategy and I think my system is much better. I truly believe that she does not know how to play poker and someone told her to buy in short and push with any pair and big ace.
Last edited by iceman5 on Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I would add

Postby GeoC » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:42 am

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Postby iceman5 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:46 am

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Postby GeoC » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:51 am

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Postby iceman5 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:07 pm

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Postby black_knight6 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:07 pm

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25K hands of Miller NL

Postby GeoC » Sun Feb 19, 2006 4:02 pm

I thought I lost a little but here are the results of this. I have to say that I did quite a bit of deviating from Miller's system. Had I stuck to it without any cute stuff on my own, I probably would have done better. The bonuses added quite a bit to my very small win.

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Postby tunkpirate7 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 4:24 pm

How much less of a roll would you need with this strategy? And yes, it's probably a bug in the software that just doesn't make the screen pop up when its your turn
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Postby excession » Sun Feb 19, 2006 4:51 pm

When i first started playing at the PS $50 tables I tried and experiment where I bought in for 40% and pushed all in pre-flop with any pair JJ or better and AK.

This was just my own experiment - long before Miller et al. - I posted results on the old UPF - over 50 pushes I got called a full 40 % of the time and was only big dog twice..
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Postby iceman5 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 4:51 pm

I got crushed this time.

Total results

774 hands
Been called 12 out of 44 times (got called 6 out of 9 this short session)
Won 7
Lost 4
Split 1

I lost 2 $30 stacks on hands from the blinds this time. UGH!. I also got called by 66 when I had TT and lost. My JJ got called by AT and lost. So, I would say it was just bad luck this time.

$28.50
1.84 PTBBs
4.31 MT rate
$10.56 / hr.
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Postby iceman5 » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:20 pm

Total results

931 hands
Been called 14 out of 47 times or 29.7% of the time
Won 9
Lost 4
Split 1


+$83.65
4.49 PTBBs
4.30 MT rate
$26.28 / hr.
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Postby Aisthesis » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:32 am

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Postby black_knight6 » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:04 am

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short stack strategy

Postby GeoC » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:54 am

The fellow who invented this was Jim Rose. In his own words:

I worked on this game theory, just for kicks. I worked out a guaranteed way to win $28 an hour in Vegas, which is a decent living for a lot of people, but it doesn’t really interest me much. But I needed to see if it would work.

There are so many maniacs at the casino. A lot of people watch TV and think they have figured out poker because they’ve watched it for an hour. They don’t realize it’s 12 hours of shooting and they’ve edited it down to an hour. All you see is bluffs gone bad and maniac moves that go well – and that’s not real poker.

So I worked it out with millions of simulations on the computer and then went and did it for a seven month period, five days a week, and it came out at $28.64 an hour. Here’s how it works. You play the low blind games. I would say the best ones to play are the $2/$5 games. In a low blind game, a bunch of chips is not strength, it’s vulnerability – unless you’re one of the best players around (and if you’re one of the best players around you wouldn’t be playing the $2/$5 games!). Too many people want to look at a flop and anybody playing the $2/$5 has only a certain level of ability. That means that their big chip stack in front of them, if they stay there long enough, is gonna get sucked out from under them.

What is the only move a pro would make if he was on a short stack? He would go all-in if he had A-A, K-K, Q-Q or A-K. So I’ve simplified the game down to one move, because that is the move the best pro in the world would make.

So, you buy in for $140 – let everyone else have the big stacks. You sit there and wait for one of those four hands. If you’ve got a maniac to your left, you limp in and let him raise it and go all-in when it comes back to you. You’re going to see one of those combos on average once in about 43 or 44 hands. So, say you’ve blinded down to about $120. If no one calls you when you go all in, you’ll have probably picked up about forty dollars. So now you’re at $160. Then you’ll blind down another $20 or so (your original buy-in), before you get a shot at it again. If someone does call you the first time, and you win, you’re at about $240 and you’re $100 ahead, so you cash out and put your name back on the list, or walk across the street to another casino and do the same thing.

It’s just money management. You cash out and buy back in for $140 and do the same thing again. It’s foolproof. It’s chump bait, because if you’re down to $140 and there are all these big stacks, and there’s already $60 in the pot, someone’s going to call you with a KJ suited or whatever.

"Chris “Jesus” Ferguson – who’s a good friend of mine – took a dollar and turned it into $20,000 over a five-month period using my system – just for a lark in his spare time. Isn’t that funny? They’re a little tighter online than they are in Vegas, so what you want to do is play four screens at the same time, each with sixty dollars. Doing that will actually make you more money. That comes to $37 per hour and some change."

-geo
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Postby black_knight6 » Mon Feb 20, 2006 11:17 am

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