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Dumpy or no dumpy?

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Dumpy or no dumpy?

Postby k3nt » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:21 pm

$25 NL 6-max at Bodog.

Down to 5 at the table. [Ah][3d] in the BB. Folds to SB who raises to 3x, I call. SB has been pretty tight, so I think I'm behind most of his range here. But I have position and he's giving me some good implied odds so no way I'm folding.

Pot $1.50. Flop [Qh][Jh][Th]. He leads $1.50, I insta-min raise, he instacalls.

Why the minraise? I do it all the time with big draw type hands. In a blind battle I'm not willing to flat call here because he'll push me off of most turns with another bet. If I raise I get to take charge cheap. Yeah I know decent players should reraise with big hands, but just about nobody ever does.

Pot $7.50. Turn [9h]. He leads full pot again -- $7.50 (!!!) -- and has $12 left behind.

What should I do?
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Postby Danhdan » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:33 pm

I think the minraise on the flop is a drawing hand usually, and for people who don't get that they pretty much call the minraise anyway, so all it does is increase the size of the pot without really giving your opponent an option to fold here unless he's completely on air w/ no draw.

On the turn, I call. My first inclination was to push him in, but I don't think he is calling with a worse hand, and I want him to bluff off the rest of his chips. I don't think he's folding if he has a set either, so I like a call and let him bluff again. If he checks river, push.

In a blind battle, it's hard to give the other guy as much respect as you would any other position.
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Postby Al Green » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:35 pm

Well, either he has you beat or he doesn't think you have a [h]. How long did he take to fire that bet? I'd be more inclined to call him down if he did it in under 5 seconds - most people can't help but pause and admire the straight flush they just nailed.

The problem with your min-raise is that neither of you knows much about each other's hand as you go to the turn, giving him the advantage when you don't have the nuts and he's willing to be the first to fire at a scare card.
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Postby Semillon » Fri Mar 16, 2007 5:21 pm

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Postby DonkiFornication » Fri Mar 16, 2007 5:22 pm

[Ts][Tc]
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Postby NorthView » Fri Mar 16, 2007 11:01 pm

The min raise makes your hand pretty transparent to most players. Call.
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Postby k3nt » Sat Mar 17, 2007 11:33 am

In defense of the minimum raise ... It is a free card play. And it works all the danged time.

This guy had [Kh][Ks]. How bad is his flat call of my minimum raise!? But it's typical. At $25 and $50 NL, and even at the $100s, the minimum raise makes people get scared. Unless they have the nuts, they freeze up and freak out and just call. And if they don't improve, they'll check it to you again on the turn.

He hit the one card in the deck where he stacks me. I took the general advice and called and let him push the river and called that too.

At $25-$50 NL I think the turn is actually a fold, though. Nobody at those levels is good at bluffing into shown strength on a scary board like this.

Interesting point there by Al Green (welcome to BTP, by the way!) about the "take a moment to admire." This guy did hesitate a few seconds.
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Postby Triple B » Sat Mar 17, 2007 9:13 pm

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Postby k3nt » Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:31 am

Maybe I'll stop defending the minraise, then. Obviously I don't do it all the time. It's actually pretty rare for me.

When I have immediate pot odds to call, especially multi-way, I call. When I have a really big draw, I try to figure out how to get all-in on the flop. When I have enough information to put somebody on a hand that I think they can fold, I raise big. When I have enough information on someone's hand to know that they will pay me off if I hit, giving me implied odds to hit my draw, I call.

It's only when I don't have any clue what the other guy has, and I don't have immediate pot odds to call, and I don't have enough outs to push, and I'm in position, and I don't have any reason to think that the guy will reraise me, and I think that a minimum raise will disguise my draw so that I'll get paid if I hit ... only when ALL of those things apply is a minimum raise appropriate.

So if any new players happen to be reading this: MINIMUM RAISE RARELY. Thanks. :)
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Postby ua1176 » Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:57 am

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Postby k3nt » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:02 am

What would you do instead? I promise to do the same next time.
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Postby ua1176 » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:30 am

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Postby DonkiFornication » Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:41 pm

[Ts][Tc]
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