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2 rivers - Live Poker Forums

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2 rivers

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2 rivers

Postby iceman5 » Mon May 14, 2007 3:11 am

2/5 live...I have to set this up a bit.

I just sat down at this new table. Ive played with a couple of the guys and they are standard TAGs. The rest of the lineup is weak. There was a hand where UTG raised $15 and got 3 calls. I was in the BB with 32. I sat there for a minute contemplating. The UTG raiser said "I have a pretty good hand". I said "me too...about this good" and I raised to $115. It folded back to a guy im MP who was talking about putting me all in. I knew damned well he was going to fold and he finally did and showed JTs. UTG had T9s just as I suspected. A war has been ignited.

About 10 mins later I get a seat change because I wanted to be able to see the GS / Utah game. I moved and now and am directly to the guy who had JTs' right. Not the greatest spot because he thinks hes the table captain. Obviously there is a new captain now 8-)

So anyway.......Im LAGging it up. My preflop raises are getting called alot more but nobody is playing back at me. Ive shown down some funky hands and I have seen people rolling their eyes as I drag the pots.

#1) EP limps, I raise to $25 with [Ac][Jd]. My Ex-Table Captain (ETC) calls. The limper calls also.

Pot $80. Flop [As][2d][2c]. EP checks, I check and ETC checks and says he has a 2. Whatever.

Pot $80. Turn [8h]. EP checks, ETC again says he has a 2. I check again. ETC bets $45. EP folds and I call.

Pot $170. River [2s]. ETC says "now I have to go all in". He has about $600 left. I say "The action is on me, sir". He grumbles something. I get a tad huffy on purpose and say to the dealer "his action is binding isnt it?" The dealer calls the floor. The floor rules that his action is not binding because it out of turn. I already know this. I make a smallish deal out of it and then I check to him. He says "you check?" and then he again says hes all in.

Call or fold? Remember....I raised preflop and checked that ace twice. Ive been raising alot and betting flops left and right. No way he thinks I have an ace....but I also made it fairly clear I thought his "all in" action should be binding and then he still did it after I checked. Call or fold?

#2) I limp [Ad][6d] after a couple limpers.

Pot $20 Flop [7d][7c][5d]. Checked to me and I bet $15. EP calls. Hes pretty solid. The only mistake ive seen him make was when he raised $20...I called with 44. Flop was A52. He bet $15 into the $50 pot and I raised him. He folded his KK face up. If he bet $40 I wouldve folded.

Pot is now $50. Turn [Ts]. He checks, I bet $40. He calls.
Pot $130. Turn [2d]. He checks, I bet $100. He check raises to $300. We both started the hand with about $900.

Please dont say check behind on the river now that you saw the check raise. No way I can check and theres no way is he putting me on the nut flush. Nobody bets flush draws like this in this game.

There are also very few river check raises in this game. This is the 1st big one Ive seen today. But would he check / call all the way with a boat?

Call or fold....or shove?
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Postby Aisthesis » Mon May 14, 2007 8:36 am

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Postby soop » Mon May 14, 2007 10:06 am

Hand 1- Fold. This is close, but I like your little act there and I think you got a bit of incentive to fold. Also people tend to tell the truth too much when bullshitting (or pretending to). They think they disguise it, but the chance of him having a 2 is tons higher than if he hadn't said anything.

Hand 2 - Call. Agree with AI. I can't really see doing anything else without a sick read.
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Postby droqqa » Mon May 14, 2007 10:16 am

Hand 1

Given the table talk, I fold.

Hand 2

This seems like a standard call to me, although I can see the case for a shove if you think he pays off with any flush. He would have to be pretty bad for that though. A fold is sooooo out of the question, without some sick read.

D
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Postby iceman5 » Mon May 14, 2007 7:39 pm

#1) This hand was very very tough.

Looking back, here are my 2 options

a) Bet $100. If he still pushes, then he either has a 2 or an ace and I have still have a tough decision but I cant be bluffed out of the pot

b) Check to him. If he still shoves its either a total bluff, a split or he has quads. This way I get the advantage of lettign him bluff off his whole stack. The problem is that his bluff might work and make me fold since I cant imagine he will still bluff after he thinks Im about to snap him off.

I folded and he showed [Td][7d]...............UGH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! %)&@$%$^T&^)^#@& @^$ son of a &($#%(^&*^.

In hindsight it looks like the worst laydown in history since I set him up perfectly for this exact play, but I still cant believe he bluffed after all the table talk. Maybe hes just an idiot. I cant believe any good thinking player would do that. Oh well, it happens.

#2) Another super tough one. I actually never really considered pushing.

Case for a fold...

a) Nobody at these stakes check raise bluffs the river as a bluff.

Case for a call

a) He was betting his hands for value all night and drawing at some hands like everyone does. So how can he have a boat? I think he would bet the flop if he had a 7, especially with a flush draw sitting there. Maybe he checks 55, but since he cant put me on a flush, he would probably bet lead the river so i cant check behind if the flush scared me.

b) Nobody check raise bluffs the river, but he doesnt have to be bluffing. It looks like hes chasing the flush, hit it, and now wants to take advantage of my LAGness and check raises for value.

So I called. he had quad 7's.

I think Im happy with these 2 plays even though both turned out to be wrong.

Later in the night there was a hand with a board of A9994. I called a flop bet with AJ. Checked behind on the turn and called the guys river bet. Of course the guy had uads. Why wouldnt he? (This guy didnt see the other A228s hand). Sometimes things just dont go your way it seems.
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Postby Schuster » Mon May 14, 2007 8:32 pm

Hand 1, you completely muddled everything with your act about him being all in. If he's going to bluff shove all his chips, why are you going to make a big stink about you wanting him to do so? You should have kept it quiet, or said that you had checked, something. Don't make a big deal about it. Don't call the floor. Once you make the big deal about it, a "thinking player" could either shove or not. After all, you called floor and said his action should be binding, but then checked once they said it's not. Seems a bit odd to me.

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Postby iceman5 » Mon May 14, 2007 8:39 pm

Well, I didnt think he would ever bluff all in after I made it sound like I wanted his action to be binding. At that point I thought if he shoves, he either has an ace or a 2 and since I couldnt imagine this guy who was more aggressive than me, checking an ace on the flop, I leaned towards him really having the 2 and I folded.

I wouldve felt pretty friggin stupid if I called $600 into that medium sized pot and lost to quads. I mean, I wouldve shoved like that with a 2 alot of times.
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Postby Aisthesis » Tue May 15, 2007 12:31 am

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