This may be ther wrong section for this - if so, go ahead and move it or delete with my apologies. As the title says, it's a rant but it's regarding dealers in NL games so maybe it does belong here because of the NL connection... anyway...

I'm usually the dealers best friend... I don't like them getting a heard time from players. Fact is they're human (most of them anyway) and they're going to make mistakes but for crying out loud - part of being a professional anything is understanding one's field and continually striving to learn and improve one's ability. If you're a dealer - that means undertanding the game your dealing and how your actions affect things. The dealers mission is to control the game and to not allow their actions to affect the outcome of a hand. Certain things are simple... when the fourth club hits the board on fifth street and it's checked around the dealer is NOT supposed to say, "Ok, whose got a club?"

Other things are more subtle. Last nigth - three times in the same 30 minute down I had an opponent go all-in on me on the river when a scare card came up. They might have had it - they might not have... I needed more information. So I asked the player who bet, "How much have you got there?" I want to see him count it. I want to see whether his hands shake. I want to see how he sits in his chair while he counts them down. I want to see whether he throws the last $27 of the $427 in with a flourish or stacks them neatly. I want to see whether he speed counts or is methodical. There's alot of information I can get if he'll just count the damn thing down. In all three cases the dealer stopped him from counting it down and said, "I'll get it." The player can request the dealer count down his chips for him but the dealer is never supposed to volunteer to do it.

I know it's a catch 22. If the dealers understood poker better, they'd probably be playing themselves and have quit dealing... since they don't understand some of the nuances of the game - they often make decisions that affect the play of a hand. Recently I had a hand come up in which I accurately put a player on AK. The flop came all rags with 2 hearts. I had a flush draw and a gutshot and decided to play it aggressively against this player. My opponent decided to hang in there for his overcards. I wans't able to see his chip stack till it was too late (he was in seat 1 and I was in seat 10 and the dealer wouldn't lean back) and as a result had him down to $25 by the river. When all the cards were out - neither of us had improved but rather than bet $25 at a $600 pot which would have covered him, I bet $500 to show strength (this particular player would have judged the strength of my hand based on the amount that I bet not the amount that he would have to call)... as he was about to throw away - the dealer said, "It's only $25 and the pots like $600." My opponent reconsidered and said, "Yeah I guess you're right." and then went ahead and called. What was the dealer thinking?

Anyway, thanks for the place to rant...

TUP

Don't blame you for ranting. I'd have been ranting at the table, probably, most likely.\

"What? He can't count?"

I think I would have had a chat with the dealer in the parking lot.

Can you not request a change in dealers? Or are they all this way?

Wow, what lack of professionalism. Despite being a lowly $50 online NL player still trying to learn the nuances of the game, even I can quickly realize how these dealers are affecting the game when they shouldn't. I occassionally see the last scenario online where someone is left with 2 bucks on the river and is mulling over an allin bet with a $35 pot....I'm dying to text in "it's 2bucks...better than 18:1 odds," but I refrain and I'm not even getting paid to keep my mouth shut.

As one who always demands good customer service, I would be the first to privately let the dealer know or the floor boss of the matter. Though both you and the dealer are professionals working at the same place, and I'm sure you need to consider your future work environment when you push this issue. Guess you could always change the work place.

Definitely one of the major advantages of playing online is not dealing with the dealer. Not having to tip is nice, but not having to put up with mistakes is the best part of it, in my opinion. Especially at the lower limits, you see some pretty horrible dealers. Maybe 1 in 10 is good enough to move on and deal higher games. I'm willing to give someone new a little slack, but after 3 or 4 weeks you should be pushing the pot to the right person.

Once I was playing at a table with a drunk fish. The guy was in every hand and had built a large stack through some big suckouts. Because he was drunk, though, he kept making mistakes as to when and how much to bet, and the dealer kept riding him and arguing with him to the point that he said "I don't need this anymore," and left. Man I was pissed about that. Just tell the guy how much to bet, don't spend a minute arguing with him about it -- your job is to move the action along.

I would say TUP you have a reason to rant. I can see why the dealer wants to count the chips for someone else to keep the game moving but they really should know better. Since you are pretty well know where you play since you play there a lot I think that you should have a little chat with the floorman and explain your issue. Floormen are usually pretty good about stuff like that especially if you explain why.

The last one is absolutely unexcusable. How often have you heard a dealer tell players one player to a hand when someone is trying to get some adivce from his buddy who is not playing. Well this is even worse, this I would definatly say something to the dealer, the floorman or both.

One of my major pet peaves is when someone at the table thinks they are such a great poker player that they feel the need to call out their read out load. The other day I flopped the nut straight in the BB, with a perect rainbow flop. I check someone bets and three people in front of me call. This guy who I play with a lot who is on of those people who thinks since he can read the board he his a pro, Says so who has 7/6 that the nuts. I wanted to reach across the table and deck him. This guy didnt even have a hand. I won the pot but this jerk probably cost me at least a couple of bucks.

As a former dealer (admittedly, many years ago),I find this type of commentary truly inexcusable...Like many professions, there are good ones and bad, but geez, try not to be terrible!!! Although 7- stud isn't wildly popular, it is still played regularly, and the dealers are trained (and I assume mandated) to call out "possible straight-possible flush), which I always found annoying as hell...This may be part of the reason for 'over-talking"...I know TUP is a live game player, but this a great example of the benefits of online....
Bobby

The last example (the dealer basically goading the player into calling) is inexcusable almost to the point of complete incompetance. I'd have spoken to the floorman (or even the manager) and done my best to ensure that guy never deals on my table again.

Monk
xxxxx

The kinds of dealers that I hate though, are the ones that ALWAYS think they're right and will never listen to you.

As far as Vegas goes, do dealers keep their own tips? Because at the casinos around here in Vancouver, the tips are pooled, so there is no incentive for a dealer to do a good job. They get the same tips anyone else would.

*nods*

Yes, dealers keep their own tips here in Vegas - I can't imagine why a good dealer would work somewhere that pools them - wasted talent.

That really is a dumb idea having dealers pool their tips. This give the dealers no incentive to do a good job and be nice. Unlike a lot of players I tip the dealers based on how what I think of them. There is one dealer at one of the local casinos who I wont tip, the guy is a grumpy jerk and makes the game less fun. Those dealers that are nice, keep the game moving and dont make stupid comments like TUPs friend I tip more.