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Losing Streak

Postby Detour » Wed May 10, 2006 8:02 am

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Postby GodlikeRoy » Wed May 10, 2006 8:19 am

Poker is silly.

It is not enough to be good at chess, you must also play well.

Somewhere in the world someone is training when you are not. When you race him, he will win.

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Losing Streak

Postby Detour » Wed May 10, 2006 11:50 am

Thank you for your reply.

I am basing my concern at both Stars and Party. Together the number we're talking about is over 100 SNGs.

Below are 6 hands from Stars. Thess 6 hands represent my largest losses in tdollars at level Vi. (the names have been changed to protect the innocent. :)

I really appreciate your willingness to help me, but I'm a kinesthetic learner. How do I use PokerTraker to identify leaks? Is it studying the hands you played that were big problems, or is there a leak finder. (;>)

It will be a lot easier for the both of us if you respond to one hand at a time.

Again I thank you for your time. I hope to get some insight from some of the other members.

Detour

$55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL VI (100/200)
9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 2: ImmoKnight (4850 in chips)
Seat 3: AkuAku (1475 in chips)
Seat 5: Twingo_ES (1240 in chips)
Seat 6: VoodooWizard (1900 in chips)
Seat 7: Detour (2230 in chips)
Seat 8: ssnarf (465 in chips)
Seat 9: PalaceBound (1340 in chips)
ssnarf: posts small blind 100
PalaceBound: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [Ks Ah]
ImmoKnight: raises 400 to 600
AkuAku: folds
Twingo_ES: folds
VoodooWizard: folds
Detour: raises 1630 to 2230 and is all-in
ssnarf: folds
PalaceBound: folds
ImmoKnight: calls 1630
*** FLOP *** [Jc 8h 2c]
*** TURN *** [Jc 8h 2c] [Qd]
*** RIVER *** [Jc 8h 2c Qd] [Qh]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ImmoKnight: shows [9h 9s] (two pair, Queens and Nines)
Detour: shows [Ks Ah] (a pair of Queens)
ImmoKnight collected 4760 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4760 | Rake 0
Board [Jc 8h 2c Qd Qh]
Seat 2: ImmoKnight showed [9h 9s] and won (4760) with two pair, Queens and Nines
Seat 3: AkuAku folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Twingo_ES folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: VoodooWizard folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Detour (button) showed [Ks Ah] and lost with a pair of Queens
Seat 8: ssnarf (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: PalaceBound (big blind) folded before Flop
POKERSTARS $55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL III (25/50) -
9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: kustomkar (1320 in chips)
Seat 2: SheaPoker (960 in chips)
Seat 3: wolff67 (540 in chips)
Seat 4: Detour (1665 in chips)
Seat 5: Boisemike (3740 in chips)
Seat 6: raysson (1670 in chips)
Seat 7: serhs (795 in chips)
Seat 8: Minus790 (1765 in chips)
Seat 9: Checkbook (1045 in chips)
Boisemike: posts small blind 25
raysson: posts big blind 50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [8c 8s]
serhs: calls 50
Minus790: folds
Checkbook: folds
kustomkar: folds
SheaPoker: folds
wolff67: folds
Detour: raises 200 to 250
Boisemike: folds
raysson: raises 1420 to 1670 and is all-in
serhs: folds
Detour: calls 1415 and is all-in
*** FLOP *** [Ad 9d 2c]
*** TURN *** [Ad 9d 2c] [7s]
*** RIVER *** [Ad 9d 2c 7s] [Jd]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
raysson: shows [Qs Ac] (a pair of Aces)
Detour: shows [8c 8s] (a pair of Eights)
raysson collected 3405 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3405 | Rake 0
Board [Ad 9d 2c 7s Jd]
Seat 1: kustomkar folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: SheaPoker folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: wolff67 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Detour (button) showed [8c 8s] and lost with a pair of Eights
Seat 5: Boisemike (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: raysson (big blind) showed [Qs Ac] and won (3405) with a pair of Aces
Seat 7: serhs folded before Flop
Seat 8: Minus790 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: Checkbook folded before Flop (didn't bet)
POKERSTARS $55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL VI (100/200) -
9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 5: Detour (1760 in chips)
Seat 6: suzzer99 (1320 in chips)
Seat 9: prostoccio (10420 in chips)
Detour: posts small blind 100
suzzer99: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [Qh Qc]
prostoccio: raises 200 to 400
Detour: raises 600 to 1000
suzzer99: raises 320 to 1320 and is all-in
prostoccio: folds
Detour: calls 320
*** FLOP *** [Ks 6h 3s]
*** TURN *** [Ks 6h 3s] [9h]
*** RIVER *** [Ks 6h 3s 9h] [9d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Detour: shows [Qh Qc] (two pair, Queens and Nines)
suzzer99: shows [Kh Ah] (two pair, Kings and Nines)
suzzer99 collected 3040 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3040 | Rake 0
Board [Ks 6h 3s 9h 9d]
Seat 5: Detour (small blind) showed [Qh Qc] and lost with two pair, Queens and Nines
Seat 6: suzzer99 (big blind) showed [Kh Ah] and won (3040) with two pair, Kings and Nines
Seat 9: prostoccio (button) folded before Flop

POKERSTARS $55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL IV (50/100)
9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: Torrin (860 in chips)
Seat 2: wally109 (1140 in chips)
Seat 3: edizzle777 (2350 in chips)
Seat 4: Sawaqdeh (4135 in chips)
Seat 5: NECTAR29 (1295 in chips)
Seat 7: arceopteryx (1430 in chips)
Seat 8: Thunderbyrd3 (850 in chips)
Seat 9: Detour (1440 in chips)
arceopteryx: posts small blind 50
Thunderbyrd3: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [Qd Qc]
Detour: raises 200 to 300
Torrin: raises 560 to 860 and is all-in
wally109: folds
edizzle777: folds
Sawaqdeh: folds
NECTAR29: folds
arceopteryx: folds
Thunderbyrd3: folds
Detour: calls 560
*** FLOP *** [8d 7h Tc]
*** TURN *** [8d 7h Tc] [7d]
*** RIVER *** [8d 7h Tc 7d] [Ad]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Detour: shows [Qd Qc] (two pair, Queens and Sevens)
Torrin: shows [Qs Ac] (two pair, Aces and Sevens)
Torrin collected 1870 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1870 | Rake 0
Board [8d 7h Tc 7d Ad]
Seat 1: Torrin showed [Qs Ac] and won (1870) with two pair, Aces and Sevens
Seat 2: wally109 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: edizzle777 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Sawaqdeh folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: NECTAR29 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: arceopteryx (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: Thunderbyrd3 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: Detour showed [Qd Qc] and lost with two pair, Queens and Sevens
POKERSTARS $55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL III (25/50)
9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 2: russofriends (3425 in chips)
Seat 3: condemn (1825 in chips)
Seat 5: Detour (1370 in chips)
Seat 6: PokerAcer (4165 in chips)
Seat 7: zazlm (1260 in chips)
Seat 8: Premier (1455 in chips)
condemn: posts small blind 25
Detour: posts big blind 50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [Ac Jd]
PokerAcer: folds
zazlm: folds
Premier: folds
russofriends: folds
condemn: calls 25
Detour: raises 100 to 150
condemn: calls 100
*** FLOP *** [6h 9s Js]
condemn: checks
Detour: bets 250
condemn: calls 250
*** TURN *** [6h 9s Js] [Jh]
condemn: checks
Detour: bets 400
condemn: calls 400
*** RIVER *** [6h 9s Js Jh] [7h]
condemn: bets 650
Detour: calls 570 and is all-in
*** SHOW DOWN ***
condemn: shows [2h Th] (a flush, Jack high)
Detour: shows [Ac Jd] (three of a kind, Jacks)
condemn collected 2740 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2740 | Rake 0
Board [6h 9s Js Jh 7h]
Seat 2: russofriends (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: condemn (small blind) showed [2h Th] and won (2740) with a flush, Jack high
Seat 5: Detour (big blind) showed [Ac Jd] and lost with three of a kind, Jacks
Seat 6: PokerAcer folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: zazlm folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: Premier folded before Flop (didn't bet)
POKERSTARS $55+$5 HOLD'EM NO LIMIT - LEVEL VI (100/200)
9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 5: Detour (1760 in chips)
Seat 6: suzzer99 (1320 in chips)
Seat 9: prostoccio (10420 in chips)
Detour: posts small blind 100
suzzer99: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Detour [Qh Qc]
prostoccio: raises 200 to 400
Detour: raises 600 to 1000
suzzer99: raises 320 to 1320 and is all-in
prostoccio: folds
Detour: calls 320
*** FLOP *** [Ks 6h 3s]
*** TURN *** [Ks 6h 3s] [9h]
*** RIVER *** [Ks 6h 3s 9h] [9d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Detour: shows [Qh Qc] (two pair, Queens and Nines)
suzzer99: shows [Kh Ah] (two pair, Kings and Nines)
suzzer99 collected 3040 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3040 | Rake 0
Board [Ks 6h 3s 9h 9d]
Seat 5: Detour (small blind) showed [Qh Qc] and lost with two pair, Queens and Nines
Seat 6: suzzer99 (big blind) showed [Kh Ah] and won (3040) with two pair, Kings and Nines
Seat 9: prostoccio (button) folded before Flop
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Postby hard2tel » Wed May 10, 2006 3:16 pm

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Postby Tressemy » Wed May 10, 2006 6:10 pm

I tend to agree with Hard2tel -- while 100 SNGs is a lot, you could just be experiencing a long unlucky streak.

In reviewing the hands you posted, I think the call with the 88 was the weakest play. Unless you had some read on the raiser indicating that he would push you in with any 2 cards, his raise definitely signalled a very strong hand. Dump the 88 and move on to greener pastures.

Your first hand was an interesting one to me. With the AK, I would have been tempted to call the early raise and see the flop as cheaply as possible. My thought would be that if the flop hits your A or K, you have a very good chance of winning the hand and you have position on the raiser. If the flop misses, you can walk away from the hand and your stack is still about average. By tossing all your chips in the middle pre-flop, you face the risk of missing the flop with no chance to dump the hand. Not a bad play, just not very safe either.

Generally, it looks like you are playing well, maybe just running into a down swing in the cards. Stick with it and come back to report the good news when things turn around for you.
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Postby GodlikeRoy » Thu May 11, 2006 2:55 am

hand 1 - you played it perfectly

hand 2 - don't raise preflop, just call, and definitely don't call the allin there

hand 3 - i'd just push allin preflop there rather than the re-raise to 1000 leaving 320 chips behind, it's not a big problem but that usually indicates a little more strength than a push allin does, anyway, this hand was just bad luck too

hand 4 - fine

hand 5 - fine.. and my god, he called on the flop with Ten high and a backdoor flush draw?

Also, do you multi-table? 100 SNGs isn't a lot really, i've had break-even or losing streaks that have lasted several hundred SNGs, all you can do is make the best play in each situation and in the end, the results will follow.

Keep posting hands aswell, it's a great way to improve on your game and this forum is an amazing tool to a poker player wanting to learn :)

As for using PT to identify leaks, it's hard to do for tournament games as the blinds are increasing and your opponents (and you hopefully!) will play differently during different levels of blinds, as well as differently when the table is 9handed to when it's 4handed.. so there isn't much you can use PT for finding leaks in STTs i'm afraid to say..
Poker is silly.

It is not enough to be good at chess, you must also play well.

Somewhere in the world someone is training when you are not. When you race him, he will win.

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Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:43 am

Postby flafishy » Thu May 11, 2006 1:08 pm

"It's all over, baby." -- Scotty Nguyen
"It's all downhill after the first kiss." -- Lou Reed
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Postby Detour » Thu May 11, 2006 1:41 pm

Thank you everyone for your time and thoughts. I played another 5 SNGs today and no ITMs at all.

I think I might have identified a leak or two though.

1. I believe I'm too ready to put my money in the pot. I think that going all in is going to make the other person fold, but they still enter the pot with either the nuts or trash and draw out on me.

I don't mind losing to the trash suckouts, believe it not. Yeah it hurts, but eventually I'll get theitr money. It's the nuts that hurts, because I was outplayed.

2. From my old habits in ring games, I think I'm overvaluing hands like AJs, AQs or u, AKs or u preflop;KQs, 1010, JJ, possibly QQ and middle pairs 77, 88, 99 and 1010.

I am gratefull to you all, because now I now how to find my leaks.(maybe)

I work and can only play a certain nmumber of SNGs a day. I plan on reviewing each hand that I played in the 5 SNGs today and see what I might find..

I hope you guys and gals don't mind if I post a few new hands for your advice. I'll do so in another post rather than a reply. This thread may get old quick.

I apologize for taking and not giving, but I ain't got nothin' to share with you experts. Your probably the same players that are kicking my ***. :)

Thank you all for your kindness and welcome to the forum.

Detour
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Postby Big_Leon » Fri May 12, 2006 7:55 am

The older you get, the more rules they are going to try and get you to follow. You just gotta keep on livin', man. L-I-V-I-N. - Wooderson

Personally I just assume everyone sucks until they show otherwise. - Nortonesque
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Postby tommyhawk » Fri May 12, 2006 9:27 am

My thoughts to detour.

You are very willing to put all your money in with hands that are good but not great. In fact I think you got lucky that you were up against hands that were a coinflip or slightly less. There is more play in the game then all in especially when you have a good sized stack left.

AK is not worth IMO to go all in preflop with good stack.

The AJ hand I think you should bet more with flush and str8 draws especially on the turn you should push and not give him the odds.

But you already selfanalysed your tendency to gamble it up early.

Good luck
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