Limit O8b starting hand discusion

[Beavis68]

I posted this on another forum but not many play O8b there. This is based on my PT data, feel free to add your 2c. This is just intended as a quick starting hand guide.

I am trying to put together some detail on starting hands on O8b based on my PT results, and what I have read. Here is a quick look. This is not the last word on O8b starting hands. Much of the comments are debatable (and I am sure Steve-O will). There were no equity calculation made or simulations ran on these hands.

A2

In the loose passive games I like to play, any A2 is playable from an position. While you like to scoop, playing nut lows will show a profit in loose passive games. Just don't jam the pot with a low only.

Having a suited Ace in your A2 great inceases the value of your hand as does additional low cards or high cards. Hands like A23x A24K excellent starting hands. With hands like A23x with a suited ace, I like to raise in late position to build a big pot but limp from up front to let oppoennts in. Even with the beautiful A234 I want a lot of opponents. You have a great low hand with a good shot at a 5 or 6 high straight, or a flush with a suited ace to scoop. Let the lesser hands in and hope to scoop or 3/4 them.

The addition of a big card like A24K, A2KK (queens and jacks are good too) or A2 with two broadway cards gives you hand extra heads-up value and you can raise to limit the field. If other player call, that is fine too especially when suited or double suited.


A3 hands

A3 hands need help to play. A suited ace or another wheel card are required to make A3 a playable hand.

I hand like :ac :3d :5c :js is a good hand. Just remember when you play post flop avoid drawing to the second nut low if your hand has nothing else going for it. A34x even without a suited Ace is also playable if the x is a 5,6,J,Q or K it is a fairly strong hand.

A4 hands

A4 needs a LOT of help. A suited is critical, along with a 5 a big pair, or two other big cards to be playable.

Example
:ac :4c :5s :kd
or
:ac :4c :kd :kh

Of course being double suited is even better. Even with the addtional help, A4 should only be played from late position or the blinds.

23 hands

2345, 2346 and 2356 are the only 23 hands I will play (not counting big pairs which I will talk about below). They are weak, and for the most part you need an ace on the flop to continue, but they have shown a profit for me.

The big hands

For big cards you only want to play hands with for cards ten and higher. AKQJ,. AKJT, KKQJ and such. Having a pair or suits greatly increases the value of these hands. KQJT with no suited cards in O8b a lot like KJo in limit holdem. You will often hit a flop that looks good but end up getting out drawn by the river. The big cards are not raising hands. You want to get in cheaply and try to scoop a big pot.

The Trouble with Trips - the Big Pair Hands

The AA hands

Virtually all hands with a pair of aces are playable in O8b. There is a lot of argument of the junkiest of these hands, hands like AA79 and AA98 with without suited aces. Many people say to play them from any position, but I throw them away quite often as they are hard to play post flop, and you usually end up fighting for half the pot.

When AAxx is combined with a 2, 3, 4 and a suited ace, you have one of the few hands I will raising and reraise with in O8b. Me opponents can call or fold, I really don't care. When combined with two other cards ten and higher and suited ace you also have a pretty strong hand. Any AA hand with a suited ace is playable regardless of your other two cards.

The other big pairs KK and QQ.

I consider sets to be drawing hands in O8b. When you flop a set to KK or QQ, there will either be a low draw or a straight draw on the board - and possibly a flush draw too. You really want to hit a full house with these big pairs vs a lot of opponents. I wont play a KK hand without it being suited, with two wheel cards or double suited. QQ I consider marginal and can be tossed anywhere but the blinds - an exception could be QQ23dsr QQ24ds in late position for one bet. Just remember that you are not playing these hands for the flush potential, but the flush can give you redraws if you flop a set and back into a flush that may be good.

[Felonius_Monk]

I think you can play most any A3 in a loose passive game. Other than that I mostly go along with this. Raising only in LP (or if you're sure you'll genuinely be swelling the pot, rather than just knocking out weaker hands, from EP) is sensible, as is re-raising your best hands (or raising from the blinds), though I like to limp even the premium stuff from EP generally (unless the table is REALLY loose passive).

Some folks advocate sometimes raising the best high-only hands, this is required for deception value (especially in short handed games and when playing against good, observant players) but in a loose full ring game not necessary. I'll sometimes raise a high only hand containing AA if I reckon it'll put pressure on the blinds or if the pot is very short-handed and there's a chance of winning it or getting it heads up before the flop. Other than that I agree with just limping them. You should add strong 2 pair hands (KKTT, QQ99 and the like, but I'm also happy to play KK and QQ with a low pair in loose passive games where there's lots of overlay).

All basically standard really. I think full ring limit O8 is one of the easier preflop games to master.

[phytopath]

[Felonius_Monk]