WCOOP Qualifier bust out hand

[Drade]

Here's my bust out hand from last nights qualifier. My hand sucked so I probably should have folded pre flop and saved my self the trouble. As I re-played the hand I couldn't peice together what he had, but the flop bet, turn check, river all in sequence should have thrown up flags and bells and flashing red lights. I could have folded and still had enough chips to do some damage which is what I wasn't really considering. At the time, I was in 7th in chips with about 40 left and he was in 6th. I also felt he was steaming a bit, having lost half his stack doubling me and another player up in the past 15 minutes.




PokerStars (8 handed)

Preflop: Hero is SB with , , , . Hero posts a blind of 50.
UTG calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, CO calls, 1 fold, Hero (poster) completes, BB checks.

Flop: , , (5 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP2 bets 500
, CO folds, Hero calls, BB calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, MP2 checks.

River: (3 players)
Hero bets 1500
, BB calls, MP2 raises 5565 , Hero calls 4420 (All-In), BB calls 2670 (All-In).

Final Pot: 18010

Results in white below:
BB has Ac 5d Kc Qd (flush, queen high).
MP2 has Jc Jd 9d Ad(straight flush, jack high).

Outcome: MP2 wins .

[Felonius_Monk]

Wow, the one thing you don't want to do when you're near the top of the leaderboard in a tourney is tangle with another big stack in a marginal situation.

As you can't be certain here which of your draws is live on the flop (if any) I'd have been tempted to wait this one out and fold there.

Once you get a second caller you have to expect there to be a very high likelihood of someone having 2 pair or a higher set. Then when the board pairs, you want to showdown cheaply. On the river, unless these guys suck, it's hard to see them calling down a full pot bet with a weaker hand. I'd bet it a little lighter, in the absence of a specific read (though you did say this guy seemed a bit tilty?). Once it's raised you need a pretty special read to call down - notice also that you're not closing the betting and either player could have you beat. I think I'd save my money.

Oh yeah, and out of position from the SB (remember, this is a post-flop game) I wouldn't complete with that hand. It's not that there's anything WRONG with being loose preflop in PLO, but it can feed post-flop leaks - that is, you got in, hit your hand and still lost all your chips. So you shouldn't have played the hand in the first place. You make it easier for yourself if you struggle with marginal spots by not playing hands that are liable to hit flops marginally. To re-iterate; the SB complete is neither here nor there, but it's big -EV if you lose money after the flop more often than you win when you hit your hand.

Hope this helps!

Monk
xxxxx

[Drade]

Yeah, it makes sense Monk. I don't even really know what I can hope to flop with my hand, since there's really no nut hand that I can make. I guess I got caught up in the "well it's only half a bet to me and with some limpers the pot's laying me a pretty good price". Since I'm not really a PLO expert to begin with, I should really try to avoid these marginal situations, at least until I get more experience with the game.

That said, I do want to qualify for the WCOOP PLO events. I gave PL hold em a go last night and very nearly got in, finishing 4 spots out. I'm going to keep playing these events trying. One note on the qualifier that I played, it was $11 to enter with unlimited $11 rebuys and an $11 add on after the re-buy period has ended. In the tournament above, while I was in 7th place with 6500, players could bust out and re-buy and be right back to 3000, so I wasn't well ahead of the field. Additionally, the chip leader at the time had about 30K, so this was probably going to be the time some players started distancing themeselves as players loosened up around the end of the re-buy period. I don't know how many seats were ultimately awarded, I guessed 5, but there could have been a few more, they didn't release that info until the re-buy period ended and I busted out just before it ended. I elected not to re-buy and add on, since that would give me 3000 and very little realistic chance to work my way up to 5th and a seat. The point I'm getting at is that I could easily drop $30 to $60 on one of these tournaments, when the tournament itself is only like $215 to buy into right? I was reading your WCOOP thoughts and I'll probably go your route, play the FPP satellites for experience and then buy in directly if I don't qualify and decide I still want to play.

Thanks for the insight as always Monk!

[Felonius_Monk]

No problem.

I'm playing the $11 rebuy satellites whenever I get the chance, and restricting myself to $30 each time I play; if I get to 5 mins left, that means I rebuy, add-on and then play after the rebuy period. First time round I had a big treble through shortly after the rebuys and finished a couple of places outside (14 were getting seats, I finished 18 but at least got my money back), second time I played a bit too tight pre-rebuy, made an add-on to 4k and promptly busted right outside the rebuy period. I'm not 100% sure of the right strategy, but my natural game is to play tight, wait for my spots, and hopefully soon I'll get into one of the places.

I'm hoping to win a couple of WCOOP seats, though I appreciate my time is running out a bit, and, living in the UK and with other stuff to do in my life, I may only have time for another 5 or 6 satellites. I'm hoping to play a load at the weekend but we'll see.

Monk
xxxxx

[semperfi]

I just posted something similiar to this in another WCOOP thread, but here is my theory on these particular rebuy tourneys, at least for Hold Em. I suck at Omaha, and having a big stack there may be more important.

If you are a better player than most of the field, then even if you bust 1 minute before the end of the rebuy period, do a double rebuy, and then the add on you will have 5000 chips while the blinds are at 75/150 I think, when the 2nd hour starts. That is plenty of room to work, especially with a bunch of maniacs throwing off chips since they can't slow down enough after the real tourney starts. It is even less important in a satellite to have a big stack at the end of the rebuy period, since you are not shooting for the top 3 spots like a regular MTT, just inside the bubble is a win.

Because of these factors I have decided to play these very tight early and try to get by on one rebuy and the add on. I won seats in my first two satellites with this strategy. I still do the rebuy at the beginning, just in case some nut with 3000 chips walks into me when I have a monster early.

I won a $530 seat to event one with $33 ($11, 1 rebuy and the addon), and incidently, another guy at my first table played tight as a drum also for the first hour and only spent $33. When it was down to about 14 people we were 1 and 2 in chips.

Cheers.