Way too much action for my meger draw

[GooperMC]

***** Hand History for Game 2986498554 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi/Lo - Saturday, November 05, 16:53:46 EDT 2005
Table Table 64914 (Real Money)
Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: louwagie22 ( $136.68 )
Seat 2: qsins ( $15.40 )
Seat 4: Dave5000 ( $52.55 )
Seat 5: Farqhuarson ( $22 )
Seat 6: matthew_g ( $34 )
Seat 8: Two_Sevn_Off ( $60.31 )
Seat 10: jev_in_mi ( $20.30 )
Seat 9: swillie222 ( $20 )
Seat 7: goliathb ( $23.80 )
Seat 3: snnib ( $24.75 )
matthew_g posts small blind [$0.10].
goliathb posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Two_Sevn_Off [ 2h Th Ac 3s ]
Two_Sevn_Off calls [$0.25].
jev_in_mi folds.
louwagie22 folds.
qsins calls [$0.25].
snnib calls [$0.25].
Dave5000 calls [$0.25].
Farqhuarson folds.
matthew_g raises [$1.65].
goliathb folds.
Two_Sevn_Off calls [$1.50].
qsins calls [$1.50].
snnib calls [$1.50].
Dave5000 folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 7h, Kh, 4d ]
matthew_g checks.
Two_Sevn_Off checks.
qsins bets [$7.15].
>You have options at Table 65857 Table!.
snnib calls [$7.15].
matthew_g calls [$7.15].
Two_Sevn_Off ????

All 3 players in the hand with me are massive calling stations.

[Kuso]

[GooperMC]

I was really baffled at this point because I had no idea what everyone had. During the time I had to act I thought of good reasons for folding, calling, and raising.

Here they are:

Folding: With 4 people in this pot it is likely my flush draw is dead and it is likely that I will get 1/4ed it my low comes. If these people all have hands it is likely I don’t have the odds to continue, but they are all calling stations so do they all have hands?

Calling: To me this was the punt option. Just call, see what the turn brings and try to outplay my opponent. The downside to this option is obviously that I will have to fold the turn to heat.

Raising: This guarantees I see 2 cards, and if I can get HU I am going to in pretty good shape the majority of the time. However, against these players I am not going to get an A2 to or anything above a J high flush to fold. This means if I raise and get called by 2 players I am just going to push out the player that I already had beat.


I posted this while 6 tabling so I didn’t have time to playing with twodimes or include all this in my OP; however, playing with twodimes now shows that my hunch was pretty close.

If I can get HU most of the time I will be in good shape; however, I am worse off against a naked flush draw then I expected
pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ah 6h kd 6d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 820 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 52 57 763 0 558 9 0 0.382
Kd 6d Ah 6h 246 763 57 0 9 460 0 0.618

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ks 6h kd 6d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 820 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 223 223 597 0 589 0 0 0.518
Ks Kd 6d 6h 193 597 223 0 0 0 0 0.482

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 2d kd qd -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 820 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 147 349 466 5 142 0 447 0.488
Ad Kd Qd 2d 148 466 349 5 0 48 447 0.512


If all of them have hands I am in trouble.
pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 2d kd qd - ah 3h qc tc -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 666 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 3 11 636 19 32 0 444 0.207
Ad Kd Qd 2d 106 392 264 10 0 36 377 0.521
Qc Tc Ah 3h 75 239 408 19 0 342 71 0.272

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 2d kd qd - ah 3h qc tc - 7c 7d jd 3d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 3 3 514 11 29 0 363 0.208
Ad Kd Qd 2d 7 21 500 7 0 36 302 0.174
Qc Tc Ah 3h 27 134 382 12 0 294 63 0.190
7c Jd 7d 3d 96 355 173 0 0 84 2 0.428

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 2c kd qd - ah 2d qh tc - 7c 7d jd 3d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 6 6 515 7 58 0 334 0.171
2c Ad Kd Qd 7 19 502 7 0 24 333 0.134
Tc 2d Ah Qh 20 134 383 11 0 24 333 0.259
7c Jd 7d 3d 101 358 170 0 0 72 1 0.435


If my flush draw is good or my low draw isn’t for 1/4 I am in good shape.
pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 2d kd qd - ah 3c qc tc - 7c 7d jd 3d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 30 149 371 8 29 0 363 0.364
Ad Kd Qd 2d 7 21 503 4 0 36 302 0.173
Qc Tc 3c Ah 6 8 508 12 0 294 63 0.051
7c Jd 7d 3d 96 338 190 0 0 84 2 0.412

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 4c kd qd - ah 3c qc tc - 7c 7d jd 3d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 135 156 362 10 315 0 93 0.515
4c Ad Kd Qd 30 77 447 4 0 96 3 0.106
Qc Tc 3c Ah 6 8 506 14 0 282 93 0.066
7c Jd 7d 3d 57 273 255 0 0 96 3 0.313

pokenum -o8 2h th ac 3s - ad 4c kd qd - ah 3h qc tc - 7c 7d jd 3d -- 7h kh 4d
Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4d Kh 7h
cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
3s Ac Th 2h 6 6 512 10 315 0 93 0.353
4c Ad Kd Qd 30 77 447 4 0 96 3 0.106
Qc Tc Ah 3h 27 140 374 14 0 282 93 0.211
7c Jd 7d 3d 57 291 237 0 0 96 3 0.330

It almost seems like a wash. I guess it comes down too how often do these guys have hands.

[Kuso]

[Kuso]

[Felonius_Monk]

[GooperMC]

Two_Sevn_Off calls [$7.15].
** Dealing Turn **
matthew_g is all-In.
Two_Sevn_Off ????

Now what?

[Kuso]

i'd either raise, call, or fold.

ok, since i know the result, i will stay out of this discussion.

[GooperMC]

[Kuso]

[briachek]

i fold because you may be drawing for the nut low that might split, but your high is not likley to be good even if you make the flush. If you are drawing to the nut flush or 2nd nut at least, i would be tempted to continue but I think its a fold as I don't like putting my money in on a draw with one card to go. This from a amature H/L player.